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Monday Morning Center Back: The Conde Conundrum

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What will Wilman do now?

That is the big question this week after the revelation on Saturday that Chicago Fire defender Wilman Conde wants the Chicago Fire to trade him to the New York Red Bulls. Chicago has already spoken, with president John Guppy making the very clear proclamation that the Fire won’t be making any deal for Conde that isn’t for what Chicago considers fair value.

What are you prepared to do? That question which Sean Connery stated so forcefully in The Untouchables is aimed right at Conde, who had to know that simply going to the media with his desire to leave the Fire for the Red Bulls wasn’t going to make Chicago trade him.

Is Conde really ready to hold out, or worse yet, stick around and give less than his full effort?

Conde has been a real professional since arriving from Colombia so it is tough to imagine him becoming a problem in the locker room, but it is clear that he gave playing for Chicago a shot and hasn’t changed his mind about wanting to leave. He has been training camp with new Fire head coach Denis Hamlett and hasn’t felt compelled to stay.

Working against Conde is the fact that he couldn’t have asked for a tougher trade to be made. Aside from the obvious concerns about trading an All-Star caliber defender to an conference rival, you already have animosity between the clubs following Juan Carlos Osorio’s departure from Chicago to the Red Bulls.

I can’t help but wonder if that animosity will make a deal that much tougher to pull off. It is no secret that Chicago owner Andrew Hauptman is still upset about Osorio’s departure (upset enough to continue pressing the league into investigation tampering charges against the Red Bulls even AFTER Chicago and the Red Bulls agreed to compensation for Osorio.) It isn’t far-fetched to think that Hauptman has already delivered an "over my dead body" ultimatum about Conde going to New York.

So why does Conde feel so disenchanted about being in Chicago? It isn’t just about his desire to play for Osorio, but also about the fact that he turned down a much more lucrative transfer move to Argentina in order to reunite with Osorio in Chicago. It is safe to say that Conde would have never worn a Fire jersey if not for Osorio.

That doesn’t matter to Chicago now. The Fire paid a $300,000 transfer fee for Conde and the 10 regular season and playoff games he played last season isn’t close to providing a complete return on that investment.

Just what could the Red Bulls offer Chicago to make a trade worthwhile? A package including Dema Kovalenko, a first round pick and cash in the $200K to $300K range is probably as high as the Red Bulls would be willing to go, though Osorio’s desire for a player exactly like Conde could lead him to include an established defender like Carlos Mendes or Jeff Parke.

Would that package be fair value for Conde? You can argue that it is, but what can’t be argued is that Chicago would be silly to ignore such an offer, particularly if Conde stands firm on his request and winds up holding out. The Fire will stand pat, hoping that Conde can be reasoned with and sold on staying in Chicago, but if Conde hasn’t been convinced by now you wonder if he ever will be.

What do you think of the Conde situation? I want to hear from readers who ARE NOT Chicago Fire or Red Bulls fans (yes, Fire and Red Bulls fans can add their two cents assuming they have anything left to say after the weekend’s thread on this story). Do you think Chicago should grant Conde’s wish? Do you think Chicago should ignore it? Share your thoughts below.

Comments

  1. …look bottom line weather New York gives Chicago an offer that they “consider fair value” or not chicago’s “best defender” hates chicago and no longer wishes to play for them. Look at the end of the day, Chicago is still stuck with a tempermental player who doesn’t want to play for them any more. Look, you can pretent like you don’t see it or that it dosen’t hurt but this is a big blow within the structure of the Fire’s organization. Ethier way they flip the card they’re still going to lose their best defender. Wheather they get compensated for it or not is another story. I’ll admit passing up an opportunity to get a player like conde going sting a little but it virtually makes no different to red bull. They begin today very much in same way yesterday ended, which can’t really be said for Chicago.

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  2. It seems like neither fan base can identify what in less leveraged circumstances would be a fair trade of talent. The quick summary from RBNY fans is, “bend over, we’ve got to reason to deal fairly with you” and from the Fire fans its, “we will not give you our best defensive player for a bag of beans just because he doesn’t understand that we can’t just sell him.” So what’s a fair way out of this mess for both teams? It seems that JCO is not one for long term planning, so why would he worry about giving up draft picks? I would be satisfied with the $300k we paid for Conde, a % of his future transfer rights (50% after the first 300K?) and RBNY’s first round picks in ’08 and ’10.

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  3. Hmmm I think this is unprofessional of Conde. He signed with the team not the coach. I understand he wants to play for Osorio, but he can’t base his career on just the coach and where he ends up. If he had a bigger offer and was happy he should have taken it, you can’t blame the Fire for that situation.

    I am not sure, as a Red Bull fan he can definetly improve our backline but at the same time if Osorio decided to go somewhere are we going to get stuck with a player who may not want to play to the top of his game because it is not the same coach. I am sorry I wouldn’t do the trade, we don’t need another Guevara.

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  4. Chicago should try to honor his wish, but not if the counter-offer is a bucket of mediocrity. There is no reason to rush him out the door for nothing. It is bad business to strengthen another team in your conference while getting nothing in return.

    Kovalenko is higher salaried than Conde while being the lesser player. I don’t see how this works unless significant allocation money is sent to Chicago. Otherwise it would be easy to assume that a (supposedly) less than 100% effort Conde is more valuable to Chicago than Kovalenko.

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  5. For anyone who says that Richards for Conde is not going to happen, consider this.

    Say the Fire hired Arena instead of Hamlett and Richards said he wanted to follow his coach to Chicago. (I know, crazy stuff, but bear with me)

    Lets say that Arena really liked Richards, in fact lets say that Dane was “exactly the sort of player he’d been looking for” So Chicago offered Conde to NYRB for Richards.

    A) Would anybody believe that the Red Bulls would not be getting fair value?

    B) Would it be any harder for NYRB to find someone to replace Richards than it would be to find an defender of Conde’s quality?

    I understand that Angel and Altidore are the faces of the franchise, but Conde is the heart of the Chicago defense and the Fire’s second most important player. Anyone who wouldn’t give up Richards to get Conde is straight loco.

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  6. So he’d rather be on NYRB than the Fire… that doesn’t make him any less of a player. I’m very disappointed that he does not want to stay on the Fire, but it’s normal in sports for players to say they want a trade and it’s also normal in sports for teams to not unload them unless they get fair compensation for them. Look at the NBA; Shawn Marion and Jason Kidd had said repeatedly over the last few years that they were unhappy where they were and wanted to be traded, but NJ and Phoenix didn’t simply unload those guys right away for nothing. Both of those guys were forced to stay with their teams for a long time even after they had said they wanted out until a real deal came along. And you know what? They both played extremely well and continued to act like professionals without knowing whether or not they would ever be traded.
    If Chicago can’t find a fair trade for Conde, we should keep him. And if he really is gonna whine and refuse to perform for the team (which I personally don’t think will happen), then we can sell him overseas rather than giving him to one of our chief rivals.

    Sweet one-liner though, Paul Camarda.

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  7. First off, with keeper Matt Pickens leaving the Fire already, I don’t care who they got to replace him, his services will be missed this season. Now possibly Conde gone or at least holding out? Well, it seems to me Chicago’s weak link this season will be the defense. Sorry, Jon Busch, C.J. Brown, just ain’t gonna cut it. Segares is the only decent defender they’ve got right now.

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  8. richards has great future ahead of him,and will be more of an impact this season than last one,in which he was a runer up for rook of the year(some ppl think he just lost that one bc he isnt from US),one of the fastes players of the MLS..thats how we see him…and he wants to be a NY player .JCO at the meeting with fans stated that JPA JA and DR are untouchable,so the team dosnt have to make any type deals.especially that would made such a hole in our offense.

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  9. I’m a Fire fan and I haven’t read too many of the comments above, but I agree with whoever it was who said that someone needs to remind Conde that it was his beloved coach who brought him here and then skipped town. That’s not our fault. The Fire should not take anything less than full value from anyone for Conde and I have a hard time seeing them getting that from NYRB. Dane Richards would help us but is still way less valuable than Conde, I guess if we got some picks or allocations in the deal it might be worth listening though. Angel obviously is not going anywhere, and I wouldn’t even take Altidore for Conde at this point considering how much of this season he’s going to miss doing duty for his country and how likely he is to leave in one of the next two transfer windows.
    Conde is a critical player for the Fire and IMO might be the most valuable defender in the league considering how many different positions he can excel at. I know that I would not take anyone else currently in MLS over him. If someone wants to work out a deal where we get Bornstein, Ashley Cole, or someone like Kenny Cooper (which I can’t even see really happening), then I say take it; but otherwise I think we should just ask Conde to be a professional and play well; and if he won’t then sell him abroad in the next window. The guy is supposed to be a professional footballer. I would think that once he gets on the pitch he won’t be able to not play. I guess we might find out.
    Anyway I really hope that we do not trade for Dema Kovalenko; I really don’t like that guy.

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  10. Smith, how does NY signing another defender harm Chicago? Conde will see he’s not going to NY, and will have the option of playing for Chicago, or whining until the Fire can ship him out to a S. American team during the summer transfer window. Either way, the Fire won’t be giving a top defender to a division rival.

    Anyway, you sound awfully cocky for a fan of a team named after a fizzy drink whose sole accomplishment (according to Wikipedia, anyway) is finishing runner-up in the US Open Cup in 2003.

    As compared to the Fire: 1 MLS Cup (2 runner-up), 1 Supporters Shield (2 runner-up), and 4 US Open Cups (1 runner-up).

    I don’t mind taking sh** from DC fans. Fizzy drink fans, not so much.

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  11. It kind of sad that conde would rather sit on the bench then play for your team…man if I were the fire I wouldn’t really put stuff like that out.

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  12. Smith,

    Do a little research before you post please.

    The Fire don’t owe Conde shyt and the Fire have cap room. Conde’s salary is $150K.

    They could eat his salary and he can rot in Colombia the whole year. So no, Conde will not be going to New York/New Jersey Metrostar/RedBull/New York unless they pay up.

    Now go get your shine box and get to work on my shoes.

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  13. OR…RBNY can sign another defender altogether & that leaves Chi-cow-go OVER THE BARREL. Stuck with a player who doesn’t want to be there & a lot of cash owed him.

    That’s what you Papa Bear types don’t get.

    Now, take Dema & go get your shine box.

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  14. Hey Paul Camarda,

    What you said is pretty irrelevant at this point.

    From what I have been reading, it seems Fire fans would rather sit Conde out the whole season than to give him to a rival for nothing.

    And it seems the Fire have the salary cap room(they lost Wanchope, Armas, Curtin) to pay Conde to sit the whole season and go out and find another defender.

    From RBNY perspective, they have the Fire bent over the barrel.

    From Fire perspective, Conde might already be written off for the season and they have moved on. One thing that will probably not happen is Conde going to the Red Bulls……….not after the JCO shenanigans in the past.

    In other words, as far as the Fire is concerned, he can sit. No sense in strengthing a rival team for nothing.

    Looked at it this way, its RBNY that has to pay up.

    That is what you guys don’t get.

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  15. Hey Bacchus, buddy

    (I don’t think its the fact that red bull wants “your top players” I think it more the fact chicago top player dosen’t want chicago.)

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  16. Coming from out west, I have to agree with the posters who are of the opinion that Chicago should not trade Conde to NY unless they come out of it as well or better than they are now, in terms of their starting 11. It sounds like Richards would be the only player that would fill that possibility. If NYRB are not willing to give them Richards, then hold on to Conde, expect him to fulill his contract. If he doesn’t, then the summer transfer window should be open, so they can sell him overseas and in the meantime ID and then sign a suitable replacement from overseas, which shouldn’t really be that hard.

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  17. MikeR,

    I think you’ve hit the nail on the head. The Fire need to see what they can get for Conde, if they can’t get what they want, they at least keep the player from going to any rival.

    That way NY isn’t getting something for nothing, but also not giving up anything unless they actually want the guy.

    The difference here is that Chicago is unlikely to get full value for Conde unless NY or any other team actually goes after him. It’s still the Fire’s choice if they’re willing to get some value for Conde or wind up getting nothing (but not strengthening another team).

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  18. Eugene, the question is really whether NY wants Conde and how much. If they do, they should pay up. If not, the Fire should hold onto Conde. I’d be happy to see Conde sit at the end of the bench until the summer transfer window opens. That sends a message, doesn’t improve a conference rival, and puts the Fire in line to receive a transfer fee.

    To me the bottom line is that we don’t take scraps from NY in order to improve a conference rival. We just don’t. Why should the Fire take a guy like Kovalenko, who they don’t need, don’t want, has a relatively high salary, and takes a guy off NY’s hands they don’t want?

    Again, the key: the Fire simply can’t turn over one of their best players to a conference rival for a pittance, while taking unwanted, and salary-eating, players off NY’s hands. Hell, I’d rather see Conde released from his contract with the Fire holding onto his MLS rights so he can’t sign with NY. That way, the Fire could save the salary cap money and keep a player out of NY’s hands. It’s not NY in particular, it’s any eastern conference rival.

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  19. MikeR-

    I’m not suggesting Conde buy out his contract and move to NY — since he would be buying out his contract with MLS, not the Chicago Fire. I’m suggesting he buy out his contract and leave MLS entirely.

    “Doesn’t it occur to you that Fire fans see Conde in exactly the same way? In truth, most of us wouldn’t trade Conde straight up for Richards if we had the choice, our right midfield problems notwithstanding.”

    Sure it occurs to me. But its not Dane Richards who wants away from NY — its Wilman Conde who wants away from Chicago. NY doesn’t need to bend to get Conde by giving up its third best player because the team can live without Conde. Chicago can no longer consider Conde core to the team’s plans in ’08, because whether he’s on the team or not, he’s unlikely to put forth the same effort or performance as he did last season.

    So the problem is really Chicago’s to solve, the fact that NY is involved in the dilemma is really just circumstantial because Conde’s preferred destination.

    (BTW, to fix my earlier post, Mo dealt draft picks in ’06 that affected Bruce in ’07)

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  20. The comments on here are just hilarious.

    New York fans want the Fire to send them one of their top two or three players.

    In return, RBNY sends the Fire a marginal squad player or two or some other deadwood.

    Doesn’t anybody on here know how a trading league works?

    If you want a teams top player, you better be willing to give one of yours up.

    To get something you have to give something.

    And Ives deal is really pathetic, and this from a supposed unbiased observer. In Ives world, RBNY sends a player that RBNY might end up cutting, $200K in cash (not even close to his real value), and a draft pick or two.

    Draft picks are pretty much worthless now in this league because the draft itself is a crapshoot and even if you draft the second coming of Zidane he might just decide to go to Europe instead.

    Therefore, Ives proposes sending a truckload of manure to the Fire and getting one of the top defenders in the league.

    LOLOLOLOLOLLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL.

    Great stuff. Keep writing!

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  21. Man, should have seen this coming. Think someone said that to me when Osorio jumped ship, that Conde would be two seconds behind. Look, they ripped us off once before, and MLS basically let it slide. Now we say, honor your contract or we take your money and bench you. If he wants a trade, it better be a good offer from Red Bulls, because as a Fire fan, I’m not going to take a mediocre deal because someone doesn’t like their role anymore and wants to go with their moraless coach. Bench him if no good offer comes. That’ll teach players that contracts are worth something in the eyes of fans, and will warn would be poaching teams, that if they want to incite player rebellion, that they will pay for it or better back up their intentions.

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  22. Look, here’s a 3-way deal I think could work (and this may run a little counter to my last post in terms of affecting ’09):

    Chicago sends Conde to Colorado
    Chicago gets Mastroeni and Terry Cooke from Colorado

    NY sends Conway, Kovalenko or Stammler, and the DP slot on loan next year to Colorado
    NY gets Conde and Bouna Coundoul from Colorado

    Colorado gets Conway in goal, Kovalenko or Stammler as d-mids and NY’s 2nd DP slot on loan in ’09
    Colorado sends away Mastroeni (who they were shopping anyway) and Terry Cooke (who reportedly wants away from the team), as well as Bouna Coundoul

    Seems like this is a win-win-win for everyone. Colorado retains a very good starting goalkeeper, adds a veteran d-mid and has a DP slot back for a year in ’09.

    Chicago picks up Mastroeni to start in place of Armas and Terry Cooke as their right wing. (Chicago may need to give up a little more here to make Colorado happy, maybe Justin Mapp)

    NY picks up Conde as a left-sided defender, replaces Conway in goal with Coundoul who is local to NYC, and lightens some of the excess depth in defensive midfield.

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  23. Conde’s days in MLS are limited. He’ll be playing in Europe later this year or the beginning of next year. Chicago wants a share of the transfer cash. NYRB would have to make this deal that worthwhile. But is that worth it to NYRB for a season’s work?

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  24. What’s going to happen when JCO leaves NY for another job (bet ya it happens before you think) and its for some countries national team? Will Wilman ask for dual citizenship so he can follow Juan there as well?

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  25. Re: Papa bear’s “Mouth breathing RBNY fans grouse about their utter inability to win anything? That’s right up there.

    CommonSense: who gives a S*** if Richards hasn’t expressed a desire to leave? Since when was that a pre-requisite for being traded in ANY sport?

    The package that includes Kovalenko is folly at best. Even including Parke in the deal. Anyone who thinks it’s a good deal shows they know absolutely nothing about the team they are trading with. Ives may be right that RBNY would offer that, but it should be it on fire and mailed right back to them.

    Kovalenko wouldn’t be a starter and Parke most likely wouldn’t be a starter either.
    With that in mind, how is trading a sure fire lock starter for 2 players who will see more action in USOC than MLS play seem like a good deal? Remove heads from a**es, please.
    Someone asked if 85% of Conde is better than Dema and Parke: the answe is: yes, because an 85% Conde is still on the field and Dema/Parke aren’t. Simple as that.

    Why exactly are we still ignoring the chance of trading him out west and letting the new team sort out the mess? Far more likely folks. FAR more likely. ”

    Aren’t you one of the guys who thought you were getting Altidore for JCO?

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  26. Look, I know about you, but don’t you think there something wrong if one of your best players came out in a press release saying, “he dosen’t want to play for your club anymore?” Would you really want people to see that?…What would people think of your club…What would they think of you?

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  27. Ok, how about this.

    3 way trade

    Conde to Colorado for Pablo Mastroeni

    Conde to New York for Fracis Doe or John Wolyniec

    Everbody wins.

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  28. FC Dallas fan here. The Fire should NOT let him go unless they get a REALLY good trade offer.

    Conde needs to be reminded that it was his buddy Osorio that left him behind in Chicago. Imagine Chicago sends him to NYRB and after a season Osorio heads on to another destination…

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  29. Eugene, I don’t think Conde can just buy out his contract and move on. But if what you’re suggesting is that he “buy out his contract” and move on to NY, that just doesn’t work, I don’t think. If that worked, Heinze would be at Liverpool now, rather than at Madrid.

    You don’t think NY should give up Richards because he is a “key member of the team” and an important part of NY’s future. Doesn’t it occur to you that Fire fans see Conde in exactly the same way? In truth, most of us wouldn’t trade Conde straight up for Richards if we had the choice, our right midfield problems notwithstanding.

    Bottom line: you don’t make your division rivals better without getting better in return. If that means we wait and sell him somewhere else during the summer transfer window, so be it. We won’t be playing an Argentinian team in the regular season or the playoffs.

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  30. I don’t see a deal getting done here considering the bad blood between the clubs.

    I think Conde’s best option is to buy out his contract and move on. Clearly its not wise to base a career move on a coach who may or may not be at the club at the end of the season for a multitude of reasons. I think Conde is being professional about this and gave Chicago ample time to resolve the situation before going public, but now that we’re here, it seems the professional thing for him to do would be buy out his contract and leave.

    From a NY fan perspective, I would be unhappy in Dane Richards and next year’s 1st round draft pick would be offered for Conde. In regards to Richards, he is a key member of the team and a core player for the future as far as I’m concerned. NY is trying to fill the hole on the left, to open a hole on the right would be a big mistake.

    Regarding dealing the ’09 1st round draft pick, I considered it a lot to deal this year’s pick for Osorio. Had NY not done that, they would likely have been able to pick up a good defender in the first round this year and not even have the issue of looking for a left back. To give Chicago two first round draft picks two years in a row would be awful planning on the part of the NY front office. Just a bad idea! If NY ends the year without Osorio, the lack of draft pick in ’09 would hamper the next coach (just as Mo’s ’07 dealing hampered Bruce in ’08). Furthermore, NY would then be in the position Chicago is now, holding onto an unhappy Conde. NY should keep its options open for ’09 without potentially tying its hands in any way, especially this early in the year.

    I can understand that Chicago Fire fans have a high opinion of their boy, but from what I’ve seen, Conde is not one of the top three defenders in this league and possibly not even one of the top five. I would put those guys as:

    1. Michael Parkhurst
    2. Jimmy Conrad
    3. Eddie Robinson

    And that’s not considering wingbacks like Bornstein; Suarez and Xavier because of their age; Babayaro, Davino, Martinez and Peralta because we haven’t seen them play in MLS yet and Bobby Boswell because he had a bad season last year. I’m sure I’m missing people, but if someone was to ask me who are the top defenders in MLS, Conde’s name wouldn’t immediately come to my mind. Note I’m a NY fan and none of the guys I’ve mentioned play for NY.

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  31. without having read any of the other comments, i think that if conde is a true professional, he will honor his contract, whether or not he likes his situation, but he won’t become a problem for the team. there is no way the fire would or even should be willing to trade such a good defender to rbny, especially since it looks like osorio is building a good team. i have heard somewhere, maybe at SBI, that a three team trade could work. maybe some other team has something good to offer that chicago might need.

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  32. I hope the Fire decline the no doubt well-intentioned advice (sarcasm alert) that they “swallow their pride” and accept some crap compensation deal. Matt in SJ says the Fire are damaging their reputation with fans by “hold[ing] their own employees in contempt.” Excuse me? Have you even read what Fire fans are posting here, or checked out opinions on Big Soccer?

    Fire fans want the team to play hardball here. The Fire will only damage their reputation with fans if they accept the kind of garbage being proposed by Ives and many of the people commenting here. The Fire simply don’t need the players New York would apparently be willing to offer. They’d be stuck with players they don’t need, don’t want, and would have to pay.

    The Fire should only accept a player or players who will fill immediate, pressing needs. Such as right midfield. Since New York wants a bargain and won’t offer Richards, screw New York. Tell Conde he won’t be going to a division rival. Tell them they’ll try to sell him out of the country when the summer transfer window opens. The Fire have no obligation to improve their division rival, Fire fans understand this, and after the Osorio disaster, letting Conde walk without significant compensation will really piss off Fire fans.

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  33. Chicago should have traded Conde already. Conde reportedly gave them time to make a trade and they did nothing. Now they are stuck with a situation that they could have avoided, and it will only get worse for all parties involved.

    Chicago should cut their losses, trade Conde to Osorio, and move on with their lives. If Osorio thought Conde was worth a $300k transfer fee to Chicago, then he will be willing to make a similar investment to get him to RBNY. These situations happen all the time, and smart teams know that while they are unfortunate, the best way to deal with it is to work out a trade and move on. One example is when Richard Mulrooney asked to leave the San Jose Earthquakes back in 2005 in order to be closer to his family. San Jose made a trade, got something of value in return, and went on to have a successful season with their reputation intact. Even better, a few years later circumstances changed and they were able to bring Richard back as a happy and productive member of the team.

    Chicago doesn’t seem to understand this and is now damaging it’s reputation among players by demonstrating that they hold their own employees in contempt. If I were a Fire fan, I would now have some serious concerns about the capability and judgement of my team’s front office.

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  34. …look bottom line weather New York gives Chicago an offer that they “consider fair value” or not chicago’s “best defender” hates chicago and no longer wishes to play for them. Look at the end of the day, Chicago is still stuck with a tempermental player who doesn’t want to play for them any more. Look you can pretent like you don’t see it or that it dosen’t hurt but this is a big blow within the structure of the Fire’s organization. Ethier way they flip the card they’re still going to lose their best defender. Wheather they get compensated for it or not is another story. I’ll admit passing up an opportunity to get a player like conde going sting a little but it virtually makes no different to red bull. They begin today very much in same way yesterday ended, which can’t really be said for Chicago.

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  35. As a FIRE fan I feel like the only like value in a trade would be a DP slot and no I don’t want Reyna unless with that deal NY picks up a substantial amount of his contract. The only other players of like value are not going to be traded by NY so this is not going to be a workable situation for Chicago.

    So the reality is Conde will have to stay with Chicago at least until the summer transfer window where other options can be explored.

    What leaves a bad taste for me is Conde saying that he would honor his contract and play for the FIRE after he learned that JCO was headed for NY. Conde is one of the best players on the FIRE so $$$ and draft picks are not going to suffice in a deal nor will overpaid aging players.

    This all is going to make for 3 fantastic matches this year, too bad we don’t open the season playing NYRB and we have to wait until Memorial Day weekend.

    Who knows maybe before the teams even meet in Chicago – JCO will get fired or leave NY and Conde will get sold to Europe or back to S. America and all the hostility will be taken out of the matches in September. Let’s hope not as I’m looking forward to this rivalry heating up.

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  36. If I were the Fire, I would tell Conde and the media that they’ve had no approach for Conde from New York. If NY makes an approach through proper channels with a trade offer, it will be considered. But the Fire are not going begging to NY with hat in hand asking them to take Conde off their hands. If NY want Conde, they’ll pay up.

    Personally, I would demand Richards as a starting point. Tell Conde, if NY want you, they’ll send us Richards. The Fire need a right midfielder. They don’t need a washed-up defensive midfielder and mediocre defender. Otherwise, NY gets stronger, and we get weaker. If NY won’t pay up, blame Osorio.

    The Fire should handle this calmly, but under no circumstances should they make a conference rival stronger without getting equal value in return. Period.

    If Conde refuses to behave professionally, wait until the summer transfer window and sell him somewhere in South America.

    Also, this Dema/Parke stuff is just silly. Why should the Fire take two players they don’t need and don’t want? Having two new players you don’t want and yet have to pay makes no sense whatsoever. The Fire would be better off ripping up Conde’s contract and saying “have fun in New York.”

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  37. As a Fire fan I think he is a good defender but not the best in the world. He is a big left footed center back. Not fast by any means and is a thug. I think we need to package him in a deal to get Richards, money, and a couple draft picks. Thats not asking too much from NY and if they turn that down then thats fine. If the agree to it we get a right winger that we need really bad and we can throw Bakary in the back where he played his college career. We are thin in the back so maybe get a defender too but either way we will be just fine with or without the baby.

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  38. “Is there anything more fun than hearing Chicago fans whine & moan?

    Posted by: Smith | February 18, 2008 at 11:32 AM”

    Mouth breathing RBNY fans grouse about their utter inability to win anything? That’s right up there.

    CommonSense: who gives a S*** if Richards hasn’t expressed a desire to leave? Since when was that a pre-requisite for being traded in ANY sport?

    The package that includes Kovalenko is folly at best. Even including Parke in the deal. Anyone who thinks it’s a good deal shows they know absolutely nothing about the team they are trading with. Ives may be right that RBNY would offer that, but it should be it on fire and mailed right back to them.

    Kovalenko wouldn’t be a starter and Parke most likely wouldn’t be a starter either.
    With that in mind, how is trading a sure fire lock starter for 2 players who will see more action in USOC than MLS play seem like a good deal? Remove heads from a**es, please.
    Someone asked if 85% of Conde is better than Dema and Parke: the answe is: yes, because an 85% Conde is still on the field and Dema/Parke aren’t. Simple as that.

    Why exactly are we still ignoring the chance of trading him out west and letting the new team sort out the mess? Far more likely folks. FAR more likely.

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  39. “I think people are looking at JCO leaving wrong as far as Conde goes. JCO left Conde in columbia and then brought him with him. So I am sure Conde doesn’t feel betrayed by it at all, he just wants to do the same thing as he did last time.”

    Then he’s dumber than I thought. What’s he going to do in 10 months when Osorio decides to take a job which he feels is a step up from the Metro Bulls?

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  40. I think people are looking at JCO leaving wrong as far as Conde goes. JCO left Conde in columbia and then brought him with him. So I am sure Conde doesn’t feel betrayed by it at all, he just wants to do the same thing as he did last time.

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  41. Conde must be a fool to turn down bigger money to follow a manager. When Osorio folded up his tent and left Conde must have considered that he had been stabbed in the back. Now he wants to get back to the manager that left him in the lurch? Truly foolish.

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  42. Now that I’ve blown off my steam from saturday, I’ll throw in my two cents slightly differently.

    There are two things here. In England or elsewhere this would be solved with a transfer fee and Conde would be a Bull. Key to that is the fact that lots of ‘replacement’ talent would be available to spend that money and fill the hole on the Fire roster. Without that desire on behalf of top-level talent to move to MLS it all falls down. Despite the over statements of best defender in the league, etc… Conde is in fact a bargain and both teams would be better off with him. If you need further proof of that just look at the maelstorm of posts on this matter.

    So unfortunately it still comes down to the fact that MLS is still in its infancy and doesn’t have the power to hash out soemthing like this as it likely will in 10 years, assuming the league is where we all hope it to be by then.

    Lastly, every time a big name foreigner is mentioned with MLS where does he want to go? NY or LA of course. There is therefore a real need for Chicago to stand up for themselves in these types of situations and say we want to be counted as a top club in this league (I know I know, DC’s won more, NY’s won nothing, etc… but I’m referring to foreign perception more than anything else in terms of attracting talent).

    That being said I think they should stand firm unless a suitable offer comes along. The Fire have cap space so that’s not a perk and the players mentioned above wouldn’t likely even make the Fire’s startign line-up, which brings to the question of what NY is really willing to part with.

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  43. My guess is that Conde is going nowhere. I think it will turn out like the Shalrie Joseph/Revolution situation from last year. I think the Red Bulls will have to offer some real talent if they want Wilman. Why would the Fire help strengthen a rival for the package Ives suggests above? Just don’t see it happening.

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  44. My guess is that Conde is going nowhere. I think it will turn out like the Shalrie Joseph/Revolution situation from last year. I think the Red Bulls will have to offer some real talent if they want Wilman. Why would the Fire help strengthen a rival for the package Ives suggests above? Just don’t see it happening.

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