With Montreal officially identified as the market getting the 19th MLS team, it is a certainty that MLS will add a 20th team. It is time to consider which cities are in the mix for the 20th team in the league.
Does MLS add a New York team to serve as the Red Bulls' arch-rival? Do fans in St. Louis finally get their dream of an MLS team? Might MLS consider a team in the Southeast, like Charlotte or Atlanta?
Cast your vote here for where you would like to see the 20th MLS team awarded to: http://www.twiigs.com/poll.js?pid=54491&color=bluedarkest
its funny how ppl are so quick to hate on Miami. the city never had an mls team in the first place. maybe in name, but look at the location where the Fusion played–Ft.Lauderdale! even then attendance was progressing but MLS pulled the plug due to ownership issues, not because theres a lack of interest for the game or team. Miami consistently ranks on top of ratings regarding soccer. if MLS should expand anywhere, it should be Miami. and if they do, then hopefully MLS does it right this time.
“Our attention is very focused on a 20th team as we speak. We’d like that team to be in New York City representing a second team in the tri-state area,” Garber said. “The Red Bulls are very supportive of that and believe that rivalry will help grow the popularity of the sport in the New York metropolitan area. So we’re going to work hard and try to get something done perhaps as early as 2013.”
are you really judging an entire region based on a newspaper and “local” news somewhere in Florida?
soccer is huge in Miami. attendance was getting better but MLS made a huge mistake in killing the Fusion. not to mention the stadium they played on was no where near Miami. It wasnt a lack of interest. it was managements incompetence.
Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that thats how many games their contract with MLS says they can broadcast.
Some folks think that companies like Fox and ESPN can magically wave a wand or snap their fingers and make things happen. It doesn’t work like that.
Orlando is not as built on snowbirds or transient populations as Tampa or Miami?? Orlando only exists because of Disney World. It has no history to speak of, and is almost entirely made up of snowbirds and transients.
The problem with Tampa was the lack of an ownership group, not lack of support. As mentioned in other posts, the Mutiny averaged 12k per game over 10 years ago. Unfortunately, the Glazers decided to put all their money into ManU instead of MLS. That is why Tampa folded, not bc it couldn’t support the team.
The problem with Miami was the stadium and the fact that they played in Ft. Lauderdale, not Miami. Both Tampa and Miami could work with the right ownership and stadium situation and if they both got teams, it would be a great rivalry. Tampa-Miami derbies would have the same dynamic as LA-SD would.
I think this is the best way to tackle the south, bring 2 FL teams in at the same time and then they could bring in Atlanta and Nashville or Charlotte together. One team at a time would not allow the rivalries to fully develop.
Ok Ives, here’s my pitch for Tampa.
The Tampa market consists of 4 million people. That ranks number 13 in the nation. Of those 4 million people, many have deep roots in the city, having lived here for 30 plus years; although there are plenty of yanks and snowbirds in the area, it’s not as much of a retirement area as people think. These Tampa natives all remember the Rowdies of the old NASL, and have missed the team since they left. The Mutiny never could never fill that void because they didn’t conjure up those same feelings and connections with the Rowdies of old. Despite all of that, and the team never having an owner, they drew an average of 12k/game, which still beats many MLS sides.
The 2010 Rowdies play their first game in Tampa tomorrow night, which is expected to sell out. The team is not only bringing back old fans, but also creating new ones, led by the younger supporter’s section Ralph’s Mob (named after original team mascot from the 70s Ralph Rowdie). The organization has done a great job building up the team and found a great partnership for their stadium. Playing at the NY Yankee’s spring training facility until getting our own soccer specific stadium instead of what certainly would be an empty RayJay makes the team financially viable in this market (plus the Steinbrenners are on the BOD). The team also has started a residency program, similar to those in England at very little cost to them (someone from Saddlebrook, the location, is also partnered with the team).
The last piece of the puzzle is the new stadium. Project developers have already cited building a new baseball stadium for the Rays and a soccer specific stadium near the fairgrounds (right off of I-4, next to the Hard Rock Casino, and 5 min from downtown). Couple this location with the high speed bullet train that will connect Orlando and Tampa in the coming years (yes it’s, happening), we have two top 20 markets (yes, Orlando is in the top 20) who will be coming to Rowdies games.
The history of soccer in Tampa, coupled with the commercial viability and strong ownership, should warrant the 20th MLS team here.
If not here, then anywhere but Miami.
In case you’re interested, I did a post at Sounder at Heart several months ago making the case for Austin as MLS city No. 20. Here’s the link: http://www.sounderatheart.com/2010/2/4/1291510/if-mls-wants-another-seattle-look
Missoula, Montana deserves the next team
“Our attention is very focused on a 20th team as we speak. We’d like that team to be in New York City representing a second team in the tri-state area,” Garber said. “The Red Bulls are very supportive of that and believe that rivalry will help grow the popularity of the sport in the New York metropolitan area. So we’re going to work hard and try to get something done perhaps as early as 2013.”
Garber has held talks with the Wilpons, who own the New York Mets. Those talks may resume.
“Our discussions, which were fairly active with the Mets, clearly got put aside with the energy that they were putting into the launch of Citi Field,” Garber said. “We haven’t had discussions with the Wilpons in over a year and we’ll hopefully reopen those discussions.
“But there are certainly many, many other potential ownership opportunities in that market. With the economy turning around, we hope to be able to start some discussions with potential other investors.”
Tampa supports their teams better than Miami or Atlanta…Miami-Tampa would be a great rivalry if you could get the people in Miami to actually care about anything besides plastic surgery and getting hammered.
Also would like to see Chivas moved to San Diego and rebranded in a way that doesn’t exclude the majority of the market. Less than half of SoCal is Mexican-Americans and less than half of Mexican-Americans are Chivas fans so why did they think that was a good idea?? A stadium in SD could be a problem, but if the Chargers get a new stadium downtown, the MLS team could build a new one where the current Chargers stadium is. Obviously this would require an ownership group with a lot of money, but so would all of the cities in this poll.
the Prem. has 20 teams last time i checked. And we need 20 teams to keep the conferences even, which the league has stated are not disappearing any time soon.
I was just kinda thinking about this… anybody ever felt that perhaps towns that don’t have at least 2 of the so called major sports might support a team better?
What about good soccer towns like Birmingham, Louisville, Austin, Las Vegas, Raleigh, Jacksonville, Orlando, Memphis and Hartford?
I mean I am still voting for St Louis even though I live in Atlanta but I think Raleigh would support MLS very well…several college kids around the area, fantastic youth soccer org…
The FO does market to families and kids, for sure. They’ve made a couple of signings in an attempt to bring the Latino market out (Ramon Sanchez, Eduardo, Andre Luiz), but SJQuakesFan81 is right – as soon as we get the stadium built, more people will come out. The team’s performance is steadily getting better – see our defense this season. A long way left to go, though!
climate is perfect for soccer as well. having been there a few times myself, i can say that anybody expecting someone to play a 90 minute game in LasVegas is insane.
the key to attendance and success is to have teams in close proximity.. darby matches… enough of these bumblf**k cities getting teams/
there’s about 12 of them right now who go out to Miami FC games, they call themselves the Miami Ultras. Once they got 20. Hence I have rebranded them as the LOLtras, and hope it catches on.
LOUISVILLE!!!!!!!!!!!! 30th largest city in the USA, largest without ANY pro sports teams. could be called “southern”, or at least a gateway to the south. massive base of soccer playing kids. could pull from Cincy and Nashville markets. border rivalry with the Crew. great demographics (several fortune 500 companies in the area, horse farms employ a large contingent of latin americans!). it would work.
Move Chivas to San Diego. We have more soccer fans than most markets. Plus, the rivalry between San Diego and Los Angles would be classic. The MLS is missing out by not having a team down here.
Tampa didn’t fold because of lack of attendance, they folded because the team never had an owner. They averaged just under 12k for their entire existence without ownership, which is better than many teams can say now.
The rebranded Tampa Bay Rowdies play their first home game in over 25 years saturday nght. Expect a sell out, the first of many to come this season. Not to mention the have a residency program, the only of its kind in the US. Ives, watch out for Tampa as a dark horse for #20.
I so badly want Vegas to get it, but I am doubtful that it will. Ives, can you update us on where the Vegas Investment group stands? Are they still around? Are they still pursuing an MLS team? Has MLS really shown interest in a team in Vegas or has it mostly been lip-service?
I say “deserves a team” for a few reasons.
1. St. Louis has a good location picked for a stadium to be built.
2. Geographically, it would be a great location with 3 other teams within driving distance (Chicago, KC, Columbus…and a long drive for Toronto).
3. The fanbase is there.
I agree that there needs to be an owner with solid financial resources, all I’m saying is that if/when an investor comes along, St. Louis should be at the top of the list. I’d be just as excited to see another team in NY.
Vegas is mid-size, diverse, no other pro sports team competition, but I don’t know how to quantify its “urban-mindedness.” There are suburb-like areas, but the geography and freeway system makes any place in the Vegas valley accessible within a 30 minute drive. So, a stadium (attached to a casino) with a retractable roof (like the investment group planned/proposed) at the south end of the Strip would be accessible and an amazing atmosphere.
Ug. Just saw this article on ESPN:
http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/soccer/news/story?id=5170713
MLS adds Montreal, wants 2nd NY club
Seattle’s 5-6 k that use to attend Sounders USL games. And for those that can’t find your team on TV regionally then you should purchase the $40 HD streams on mlssoccer.com. The streams are pretty solid and they are HD feeds which is nice and you can watch whomever, whenever minus the national games which you can then watch them on FSC or ESPN.
I would love for there to be MLS games in Vegas! I’d even pay good money to go watch teams that I’m indifferent about (like DAL v. KC match) play.
I couldn’t agree more and voted for SD, although I still think the best solution would be to move Chivas down south.
I agree that the stadium should be on the strip (the south end makes the most sense to me, near the I-15 and 215, so you have access from those freeways and it is centrally located), but even if they put it in Henderson (or N. Las Vegas, or even Boulder City), it takes 20-30 minutes to get anywhere in Vegas. 40 minutes max.
I’ll buy you two beers if you can get rid of Mr. Mohawk. Maybe make him a Portland fan or something. He gives all Seattle sports fans a bad name.
As a native Las Vegas, I couldn’t be more excited by the idea of MLS in Vegas. I haven’t heard anything from or about the Vegas investment group in a long time, though. For whatever reason, it seemed like they pulled out of contention for the last round of expansion and then went silent. Well, almost silent, there was the “scare” that they were trying to purchase the Crew and relocate them to Vegas, but nothing ever came out of that more than just rumors.
Ives, can you enlighten us on the Vegas Investment group’s status?
hmmm… you are right.
but in my head,, i see FCD taking more than 5 years + to get into the same place that many MLS teams are at now. They could move FCD to St Louis with the promise that dallas would get another MLS team after like, a one year hiatus. The relaunch of the new team would probably increase attendance sporatically instead of the gradual method of just letting them work the situation out themselves. anyways… I just kind of see FC Dallas as the lagger behind all the other teams. I cant think of any other team that affirms what the ignorant soccer basher thinks, that soccer cant succeed in this country. i just feel like even if they won the championship, they wouldnt sell out the next season
Alright, fine. As far as New York getting the 20th team, which seems to be Don Garber’s preference, that is crazy right now. And I live in Manhattan. Until the Red Bulls can get at least 10,000 season ticket holders, a 2nd team is ridiculous.
Chivas USA should move to a new stadium in San Diego. ST. Louis at least has some tradition, and maybe beer won’t be 7 bucks a pint.
Depending on where they plan on stopping expansion, they could go a number of ways. I’m not so sure they’re dead set on stopping at 20. Who knows, maybe 22 or 24 (I believe the English Championship has 24, right?).
It’d be cool if they blitzed the SE like they did the NW: Atlanta for sure, and then maybe Raleigh, Nashville, Richmond or some combo of those. I think that would help form some natural rivalries right off the bat, assuming there are solid ownership groups. Although Nashville probably would be a tough one to sell, not entirely sure they could support a team even though the WCQ there was great.
True. Mls Should target markets that can produce a rivalry for example Dc & Baltimore. They Should try to exploit what other sports Do , the ravens redskins rivalry breaks attendance records all the time just imagine how many people would support a franchise in Baltimore simply to see them out do Dc or philly even if they never play each other its good marketing and not to mention the ORIOLES suck and theres no basketball team so every year we have fans sitting around doing nothing till football season
Hah nice.
I think the Steamers are making a comeback though (in an indoor setting again). If they do, I’d be 100% behing them moving to Cleveland immediately.
There’s been a little talk of that here, but I believe they’d have to get approval from USSF to move forward. Not sure they’re willing to re-up it or not.
Agreed. I would see FCD moving before KC. Maybe DCU or NE if those crowds keep staying that way.
You have a team…it’s called the NE Revolution.
I picked the ATL location because I live there…However I really want some sort of presence in the South.
Pros
-Huge population of Latino/Europeans
-Money (Arthur Blank of the Falcons)
-USL-2 team (Silverbacks, playing at Remax Stadium close to Spaghetti Junction) might bring in a built-in fan base
Cons
-Where to put a stadium (preferred to be in ATL proper, not where the Beat are playing)
-Current demand of fans/how big is that fan base for the Silverbacks.
Wishful thinking:
Blank buys out the Silverbacks. Gets a upgradable stadium in a great place near the heart of Atlanta. Close to Dekalb and Gwinnett Counties. I’ve never been near Silverback Park but you can easily see it if you’re going through Spaghetti Junction.
Expectations:
I fully expect STL to be the twentieth. I’m not sure if MLS needs the South. It’ll be nice to have, in my opinion
Even if Hampton Roads is gravy, Richmond metro is about 1.1-1.3m, depending on whom you ask. That’s not nothing. Richmond actually has a fantastic adult soccer league (CVSA!), lots of students, and a surprising amount of non-soccer mom-ish people who like the game. It’s also a storied city with an inferiority complex, and those are the ones where major league sports tend to do very well.
Richmond is a bigger market than New Orleans, Salt Lake, and Buffalo, and is proximate to other not-insubstantial metros (HR,C-ville, DC). And it has serious corporate depth to boot! You guys should read this article: http://baconsrebellion.com/2010/04/14/creative-cities-and-major-league-soccer/
My choice for a name would be Virginia Dominion 🙂
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_United_States_Metropolitan_Statistical_Areas
Uh… dude – the EPL has 20 teams. Championship has 24. But FIFA guidelines for top flight leagues is 20, and most countries conform to that.
that would be awesome. i would love to see a team in san diego. i hope it can happen. but im pretty sure that is the reason that, for now, the team is still in LA.
“To make up for it, I’m heading over to CNN to post some soccer related comments in their comments section!”
haha that gave me a good laugh.
What’s with the “deserves a team” logic?
I don’t think St. Louis “deserves” anything. Get an owner with $40 million to buy in and then the money to back that up and acquire players.
If there was a team in the city, NYRB would lose any thought of getting any city folks to their NJ team. Anyone who would go, would go to the easiest location.
Red Bulls would then rely on NJ and they aren’t the ones they are targeting. So it’d essentially cause NYRB to be a NJ team which would dislocate itself from its heritage.
The LA rivalry isn’t exactly selling itself out, is it? And even then , those games are played by teams in the same city, sharing the same stadium.
You have to look at the big picture.
That’s now the new Citi Field parking lot at a cool $19 per game. Mets probably make more on that lot than they would on an MLS team.
There is a large Hispanic population in Charlotte. It is about time for a team in the South.
Bingo on FCD.
Soccer doesn’t have the cultural capital to let teams leave if they’ve built a stadium, particularly if they took public money to do so. The best bet with FCD is for someone to convince the Hunts to sell.