photo by Dale Zanine/USA Today Sports
By FRANCO PANIZO
The push-and-pull dynamic that comes into play between clubs and countries is always tricky, and it is likely going to be even more so come October.
Two separate U.S. Men’s National Teams will be in action almost simultaneously in little over a month, as the full team tries to qualify for the 2017 Confederations Cup and the Under-23 team attempts to punch its ticket to the 2016 Olympics. Jurgen Klinsmann’s group will be involved in a playoff with arch-rival Mexico on Oct. 10 to determine if it gets to travel to Russia in two years’ time while Andi Herzog’s side can only make it to Brazil next summer if it successfully navigates through a qualifying campaign that stretches from Oct. 1-13.
With both teams needing to tap into the player pool, it is likely that a combined 40-or-so call-ups will be made in October by Klinsmann and Herzog. Landing all the top talent is far from guaranteed, however, as the Olympic qualifying tournament is not considered to be part of FIFA’s international window.
Klinsmann is well aware of how difficult it will be to manage all that and is hoping to get some assistance from clubs across the globe.
“Obviously, we need help,” said Klinsmann. “We need help from the clubs overseas, we need help from the clubs here in MLS in order to get the players released, especially the olympic team. Qualifiers start outside of the release dates, so we badly need those players to qualify for Rio de Janeiro.
“Hopefully we get the support by all the clubs to get the players in.”
Klinsmann has the ability to summon anyone he wants since the playoff vs. Mexico is considered to be part of October’s international window, but Herzog does not have the same luxury with Olympic qualifying. That tournament is not on FIFA’s schedule, leaving national teams at the mercy of clubs, which will decide whether or not to release players.
European outfits can be hit and miss in that aspect, while MLS has typically been willing to give up its players for international competitions of such importance.
Klinsmann and the league have, however, had their differences in the public sphere in recent years, and making things even more difficult for the U.S. coach is that the two qualifying paths come in the final month of MLS’s regular season when clubs are desperately trying to jostle for playoff position.
It will be a major challenge for Klinsmann and Herzog to work through, one that they hope to tackle with as much help as possible.
“We want to be in Rio with the Olympic team and we want to be in Russia 2017 at the Confederations Cup,” said Klinsmann. “It’s going to be an extremely busy time period and we just hope that we get all the players on board and get the job done.”
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What do you think about Klinsmann’s comments? Do you see MLS clubs releasing players for both the playoff and Olympic qualifying campaign during such an important part of their season? Should the senior USMNT consider sacrificing some talent in order to help the U-23s in the event that clubs do not give up their players?
Share your thoughts below.
There is not enough time to have all theses tournaments and expect the best players to be available. .. like the past…. get the best players possible (who are available) create some chemistry and put them up against a few quality sides before the Olympics!
And why would any MLS club feel compelled to cooperate with Klinsmann at this point? Don’t worry, not going to qualify for either.
Put down the keyboard grandma!
WTP,
Well, they have to if a game is on a FIFA mandated date.
Such a stance just spite JK, would be cutting off their nose to spite their face.
If MLS wants to hurt it’s American players by not letting them play for the USMNT then JK will just have to use non MLS players.
That would be bad but not necessarily impossible to do.
One possible 23 man squad:
Guzan
Fabian, Orozco, Cameron, Ream
Williams, Gringo Torres
Bedoya, AJ, Morales
Wood
Bench:
Spector, Ibarra, Brooks, Yedlin, Wooten,Corona, Howard, Garza, Alvarado, Chandler, Bjorn Maars Johnsen, Cropper.
That leaves out the likes of Castillo, Yarbrough, Chandler, Boyd ( is he back yet?).
Save Rubin , Green, GZ, Hyndman, CC Vickers, Morris etc. for the Olympics.
Not as good without MLS guys but not horrible either.
It would add fuel to the argument that young America players should explore European and Mexican options if they want to play for the US.
Beyond what GW said, its marketing. MLS needs US soccer stars on their teams and they need the team to be successful to generate interest. Some teams might complain about the friendly dates as Toronto appears to have, but they won’t say anything about the playoff date.
Besides which, if I understood Toronto’s position accurately, they are asking to have Bradley and Altidore excused from the friendlies, or maybe just the first friendly. I doubt they ever expected anything else than to have both called in for the Mexico match.
WTP
Furthermore, even if they disliked JK you can expect managers will be professional.
Jozy was at AZ a while and still managed to play for the USMNT
And their manager Verbeek was no fan of JK and they got off to a rocky start, but eventually things got worked out:
http://www.ussoccerplayers.com/2011/09/club-and-country.html
Your post and others I have seen before imply that you would rather see the US team do poorly because of your dislike for Klinsmann. This is a sad commentary on those who hold this view and I have to question the patriotism of anyone who feels that way. I remember when the US basketball team did poorly in the Olympics. I think it was when John Thompson coached. I thought his approach was all wrong, but I didn’t want the US to lose. Same with Hank Iba and the infamous loss to the Russians in basketball over 40 years ago.
I am hoping U.S. Soccer releases Klinsmann and Gulati for changing the birth-year registration for kids playing soccer in this country. They really did it good this time.
Dates for the age groups change every so often — not that big of a deal. The “standardized” SSG chart that US Soccer put out, however, is very disappointing. It starts with 4v4…
I put the following on sa too…
Children learn the game much better if there is a more gradual progression in numbers than what is shown in the USSF chart. Yet another example from a very disappointing “curriculum” that US Soccer has put together.
Why are we not starting out children playing 2v2 and 3v3? 2v2 are the right numbers for the youngest players because the variables are cut down enough for them to process what is going on and what decisions are available to them. 3v3 should certainly be on the SSG map somewhere, right? The principles of the game change completely with a second teammate. By the time you get to 4v4, at least one player theoretically has his back to goal, and just about every principle of the game is involved. In other words, 4v4 is the game in a pretty complex form, and it would not make sense to start 5 and 6 year olds starting at this level.
The variables faced in 2v2 are plenty challenging for these kids, and it puts them in an environment where they can actually learn something. Progress from there to 3v3 and start teaching kids about triangular positioning… Then get to 4v4 at 10 years old (in terms of curriculum, not necessarily in terms of competition numbers). From there, the game will come very fast…
You mean, the change that brought the US youth development system in line with THE REST OF THE WORLD?
Oh, the horror! We’re conformists now!
Really grasping at straws here to find crap to blame on JK, aren’t we?
Most of the U23 players are squad or reserve players for their clubs so I think he will succeed in pulling guys like Green, Cropper or Hyndman. Even the MLS guys like Thompson or Serna should be fine to miss 1 league game.
All the senior team games are in official breaks, so too bad MLS that’s on you, I think that releasing your players for a single game playoff or an official friendly goes without saying…
Read where Toronto trying to keep MB and JA from the friendlies coming up, anybody got the latest on that and if they can’t go here’s my 11. . AJ———-RR. .finley——–d.williams—-hyndman—–wooten. .dmb———-JB——–GC———yedli . . BG. ..no Dempsey cuz he’s hurt and hyndman cuz his club is pissed he didn’t sign an extension and they basically sent him to the U21s so its a good time for him to show case his game. Just hope no wondo zusi and beckerman
Let’s hope TFC holds them back. Klinsmann has called on them for every friendly, even a couple of games that weren’t in an FIFA window. Both are desperately needed for the stretch run. MLS and Concacaf need to get on board with the official FIFA schedule for friendlies.
Dr M,
“Let’s hope TFC holds them back”
Is that because you are a USMNT fan and don’t want those two to play for the US because you think they are useless?
Or are you a TFC fan and care more about your team than the USMNT?.
Or are you a Mexico fan and want the USMNT handicapped going into the playoff game?. .
This is nearly always the case with CONCACAF youth tournaments. CONCACAF chooses to schedule these tournaments on Non-FIFA dates where clubs are not required to release players. IMO this is done specifically by CONCACAF as a method of balancing the talent level between the top two teams (Mexico & US) and the other nations.
As for the Oct. 10th match against Mexico I’m fairly certain that it does fall on a FIFA date so clubs are required to release players. MLS clubs may not want to release players as they push for the play-offs, but it is MLSs own fault for not taking FIFA dates off like the majority of the leagues around the world. If MLS clubs/coaches have an issue with this than they need to think about adopting breaks in accordance with the FIFA calendar.
This is nobody’s “fault” specifically, it just is what it is, and it sucks.
I’m sure over the next month people are going to assign blame directed at someone, but the reality is its just a lot of factors to try and manage, and there’s no way with all these variables, plus injury situations, that everyone will be pleased… It just sucks-that’s life.
#Square pegs into round holes
Most likely blame will be assigned according to a poster’s bias. We can already see some of that here.
Wouldn’t it be nice if the USMNT could take several of its u-23 players from the full senior team for the Olympic qualifiers?
Oh wait, they have to play a do or die match against Mexico. Great Gold Cup there Klinsy.
This is the same problem that the US has with these youth level qualifying for Concacaf every time, its doubtful someone like Brooks would be released for Olympic qualifying anyway. And even if a team says its ok, with travel and the two week tournament its almost three weeks of training and league matches they miss so guys don’t want to come and then lose their spot in their club which can take months to earn back.
Klinsmann is pulling on the Olympic strings, but these call ups have nothing to do with the Olympics unless he’s calling up a bunch of U23’s.
The fact is, these friendlies are useless, as his call-ups will have nothing to do with the ’16 Olympicas or the 18 WC. Playing Brazil when not on a FIFA date is useless because we will be facing a B team att he best, as Neynar and the rest will not be let go. In fact most of the Euro teams will not let players go on non-fifa date, meaning that most of the players will be drawn from the MLS and no matter how they do, will be completely forgotten as Klinsmann will go to his favorites for the US-Mex game in October. Useless
Either you are misreading the article or I am not understanding your post. This is not about the friendlies, which occur on FIFA dates, but about the October games which apparently do not. Certainly the first games in the Olympic qualifying do not fall on any FIFA dates so that there is no guarantee that the US can get all the players it wants for the U-23 games, plus there are some players the US may want for the playoff who could qualify for the Olympic team. The result is that the US will be hampered in fielding its best U-23 team, regardless of what club teams do, since some players like Yedlin and Brooks will likely be called to the senior team. Add to that players who may not be released, say Rubin and similar, and the US could have a much tougher time qualifying for the Olympics.
And the fact that JK still has not announced his team for Brazil, coupled with it being a midweek game and the cheapest ticket being $70 + adds up to my watching that game on TV. I got screwed the last time the NATS came to Mass and dropped a couple of hundred to see the USA get thrashed by Spain because Bradley fielded a “B” team. Felt ripped off then, won’t get fooled again
yodaboy,
JK could announce the team 2 weeks or whatever before the game.
I’ve seen other teams in Europe for example,do something like that.
And that would allow you to make your plans.
But how would you feel when a couple of days before the game, half the announced roster, including your favorite players, drop out because of injuries, real or otherwise?
I’ve seen that happen more than a few times. National team lineups in particular, with few clubs really happy to be missing their players, are highly vulnerable to this sort of last minute alteration.
To me waiting until the end of the games scheduled for the weekend before the game makes perfect sense.
Nice move JK. He’s setting it up so mls sides take the heat when the big names aren’t on the roster
It really is MLS fault for scheduling during International windows and Concacafs fault for waiting until October for its tournament, could have played in June or July when there would have been much fewer conflicts. And the article just reminds there has been disagreement between the two sides not that MLS is planning on sabotaging the USNT or U-23s. Jumping to a lot of conclusions, perhaps based on previous bias.
JK did not set up the system.
This issue is caused by MLS scheduling conflicts which might result in some teams being very reluctant to let any of their players be called up at a very critical time for them.
It would be a problem regardless of MLS’ feelings toward JK.
Isn’t what you wrote pretty much the same thing implied on my post?
I guess I don’t understand what you were trying to say.
He’s trying to say that your a piece of sh*t
Fred,
No.
You said JK is setting it up that way implying that he is shifting the “blame” and “heat” to MLS.
In fact, JK works with the “system”
http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2015/06/04/bruce-arena-thankful-omar-gonzalez-was-allowed-usmnt-stay-injury-plagued-la-
The problem is the system and it is up to MLS to “fix” what problems they can, assuming they want to.
JK’s Chicken’s are coming home to roost.
When is the roster for the September friendlies supposed to be released?
At the lastest allowable time frame smh…..I think I read somewhere that JK is releasing the roster on Aug.30th