The U.S. men’s national team didn’t leave Port of Spain as winners on the night but did achieve two of its major goals this fall.
Despite a 2-1 second leg loss to Trinidad & Tobago in CONCACAF Nations League quarterfinal play, Gregg Berhalter’s squad sealed a berth into the 2024 Copa America tournament and reached the Nations League semifinals. The Americans advanced 4-2 on aggregate into March’s Final Four in Texas.
Reon Moore cancelled out Antonee Robinson’s opening goal before Alvin Jones’ second half strike helped the Soca Warriors to a first head-to-head victory over the Americans since 2017. Sergino Dest was ejected in the 39th minute after receiving a pair of yellow cards for a pair of separate incidents.
The USMNT struck first in the 26th minute after Robinson delivered a diving header in the Trinidad & Tobago box. Dest’s dangerous cross was met by Robinson as the Fulham defender celebrated his second-straight goalscoring appearance.
https://x.com/CNationsLeague/status/1726760959107023151?s=20
Dest’s night was cut short though with the USMNT right back being sent off in the 39th minute after a pair of yellow card offenses. The 23-year-old first punted the ball into the air after a turnover out of bounds before receiving a second yellow card for arguing with referee Walter Lopez.
Dest’s ejection means he will be suspended for the Nations League semifinal round in March.
The Soca Warriors took advantage of the extra man advantage by equalizing before halftime. Reon Moore fought off pressure from Cameron Carter-Vickers before unleashing a powerful right-footed shot past Matt Turner for a 1-1 scoreline.
https://x.com/CNationsLeague/status/1726764799789355224?s=20
Momentum continued to grow for Trinidad & Tobago after Alvin Jones propelled the hosts in front in the 57th minute. Jones’ long-range free kick could not be kept out by Turner, giving the Soca Warriors a 2-1 lead.
Nathaniel James missed a golden opportunity in the 60th minute to extend T&T’s lead on a breakaway, while Andre Rampersad was denied by a diving Turner just five minutes later.
The USMNT backline would stand firm, avoiding any late drama to seal its spot in the Nations League. It marked the third-straight Nations League that the Americans reached the semifinal round.
Trinidad & Tobago will still have its opportunity of reaching the Copa America during March’s play-in round. The USMNT is likely to be in action during the January window.
Tele57
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dCSDfjAyBhY
If you have never played through one of these high end tube amps it’s hard to know what you’re missing. But far be it from me to separate someone from their tubes but then there is the issue of expense and upkeep with tube amps.
Which is the trouble with a lot of CONCACAF fields. CONCACAF needs to figure out a way to help members with keeping their venues to a higher standard.
I’m talking about stuff that goes beyond just appropriate footwear.
One of these days Matt Turner is going to fall into a sink hole and thus be unable to stop a shot. I’ll bet you if it had been Argentina, Messi might have refused to play.
I wasn’t able to watch, so I’ll keep it to generalities.
-Berhalter seems to always plan that everything will go right, ie. I’m going to tryout a two striker system but bring no true striker sub. Then when a man gets sent off I can’t take off a striker because then if one gets injured or tires I have no one striker left to lead the line. I invited 24 players so when one guy goes down before camp I don’t need a replacement but then another CM goes down so now I have undersized Luca playing in CM down a man against big physical midfielders. Bob Knight always said he planned for the very worst to happen so he was ready if it did happen.
-if Gio was on minutes restriction fine it makes sense to bring him off in the ‘42. If it was a managers decision it makes no sense. Gio could have moved next to Pepi or Balo and been the outlet if he wanted to continue using 2 forwards (which is perplexing in its own right).
people keep speculating gio was on minutes restriction. if gio was on minutes he was probably coming off in 5 minutes anyway ie at halftime. it might explain the “out” but the error is the “in,” that for the second window in a row, he had no plan B. personally i am like if you’re that worried why is he starting game 2. but GB then has to identify someone else with a somewhat similar skill set that can spell reyna occasionally — and he likes mediocre hybrid two-way types too much to do so. kind of like he resisted a 10 in the first place, or seems to wish his 6s were deep lying playmakers instead of lumberjacks.
i agree to the extent i have said since the beginning he basically frontruns — as you say. we either own a team or he spots a scouted flaw in the opponent — and we pounce minute 1. cuba for example. if it doesn’t work or things go awry he has no plan B. he’s a system evangelist and not a game manager.
and the system…..i have done that ad nauseum.
this to me is where my complaint about him relying too hard on the obvious first choice players shows up. puli and weah out, NOW WHAT? reyna off, NOW WHAT? the offense is highly personalized — reflects too much who shows up that week. it suggests the talent wags the tail of the dog and the coach is along for the ride, as he can’t find other “types” to at least mimic the same role. to do that you need to understand how your offense is supposed to work and feed the 9, and get profiles in to fit that. and be able to identify prospects who can help you and have some resemblance of what the star does. not even necessarily so they are the future stars but so we can play in some specific, functional way, even when some are out.
to me it says a lot we found a functioning formation, some people are out, and he abandons everything.
JR,
Flo spent most of that game dropped back in midfield.
Who is your choice for 3rd striker option? I thought Malik did a great job as a Gio replacement/striker replacement.
They didn’t need anymore goals. They needed the threat of goals to keep TNT honest and someone to retain possession and waste time. Someone to take the temperature of the game down a little and Malik did that.
Given his limited minutes at BVB I might have pulled Gio before Gregg did regardless of how the game was going. In fact I’m not sure I would have brought him in the first place but I’ll bet Gio wanted to go 90.
Vac, I think you and I are the only people that saw Tillman as having a really good game. I saw some place that had player rating and I think they had Aaronson ahead of Tillman. I guess its in the eye of the beholder …
Tele 57,
It doesn’t matters what any of us think about Malik. Gregg’s opinion is what matters and it’s clear he has plans for the kid.
Right now he’s the only viable sub for Gio. He’s not as good but he’s still pretty unpredictably dangerous and can’t think of any other USMNT non-starter that I can say that about.
Aaronson is an American player, run hard, run all day. When all is said and done he’s much beloved because he do that longer and further than anyone else. It’s seen as “effort”. Whereas a guy like Malik doesn’t seem to do as much and is thus classed as “lazy”.
And as long as Brenden can do that fans here seem to think that overshadows that he can’t seem to do anything else right at the moment. He’s off his best. Not by much but enough to render him Ariolla-like.
I think his career in the top flight is danger.
Now I will say all that running around pestering those TNT players was useful in a game like we had last night. Basically, Brenden wasted a lot of time but there are other ways to do that.
He’s been like this since shortly after he got to Leeds. His continuing struggles are Leeds’ fans revenge for their perception that Americans fucked the place up.
Short term, Malik’s future looks brighter than Brenden’s
Long Term, Malik’s future looks brighter than Brenden’s
Right now Paxton is more likely to play alongside Malik for the USMNT, than he is likely to play alongside his brother for the USMNT.
Lol wow, just wow. Absolutely pathetic…..no if’s, and’s or buts. DISGRACEFUL!! Attacking / forward players can’t score, our goalkeeper seems like a fraction of his true self…..against a team like T&T (and no disrespect because they were able to rattle our cage and throw everyone off their game) absolutely 100% disgraceful. USMNT team loses Pulisic, McKennie and Weah ……just three players and look this bad….. PLAYING AGAINST A TEAM LIKE t&t WITH THIS DEPTH???
22 GK Denzil Smith – Trinidad and Tobago Club Sando (STARTER)
21 GK Jabari St. Hillaire – Trinidad and Tobago / Defence Force
1 GK Christopher Biggette – Trinidad and Tobago / Defence Force
2 DF Aubrey David – Costa Rica / Cartagines STARTER
3 DF Ross Russell Jr. – Trinidad and Tobago / La Horquetta Rangers
4 DF Jesse Williams – United States Central / Valley Fuego
12 DF Kareem Moses – Finland / FF Jaro
17 DF Justin Garcia – Trinidad and Tobago / Defence Force (STARTER)
14 DF Shannon Gomez – United States / San Antonio FC (STARTER)
6 DF Andre Raymond – Portugal / Vilar de Perdizes (STARTER)
17 DF Alvin Jones – Trinidad and Tobago / Sando F.C. (STARTER)
18 MF Andre Rampersad – Canada / HFX Wanderers (STARTER)
10 MF Duane Muckette – Trinidad and Tobago / Port of Spain
15 MF Neveal Hackshaw – United States / Oakland Roots
16 MF Michel Poon-Angeron – Trinidad and Tobago / Port of Spain
5 MF Kevon Goddard – Trinidad and Tobago / Defence Force
23 MF Kristian Lee-Him – Sweden / IFK Eskilstuna
8 MF Daniel Phillips Scotland / St Johnstone (STARTER)
7 FW Ryan Telfer – United States / Miami FC
20 FW Kaïlé Auvray – United States / Sporting Kansas City II
11 FW Nathaniel James – Trinidad and Tobago / Club Sando (STARTER)
13 FW Reon Moore – Trinidad and Tobago / Defence Force (STARTER)
19 FW Malcolm Shaw – Canada / Atlético Ottawa
9 FW Brent Sam – Trinidad and Tobago / Defence Force
Most of these players PLAY IN THEIR HOME-BASED LEAGUE!!! WHAT THE ACTUAL @#$%?!!!! Nobody on this team would even make camp let alone start for the USMNT. None!!! yet we have more talent in our talent pool than most (if not all) of CONCACAF and yet we still get to see results like this?!!! With the right coach we would be able to pick players solely from MLS and Eredivisie AND CRUSH THIS TEAM. An absolutely Pathetic showing from US Soccer
“LESS IS ONLY MORE WHEN MORE IS NO GOOD”….Frank Lloyd Wright
as i pointed out elsewhere, germany followed our blowout with a mexico tie and a loss to turkey. and ghana lost to mexico then barely beat madagascar 1-0 at home with a 90+6 goal in injury time.
i have also pointed out a longer term results pattern where we closed out 22 quali with a loss in CAN, tie in MEX, loss in CR; tied saudi and uruguay in friendlies and lost to japan; tied ES with the infamous horvath howler; tied wales and england and lost to holland at the world cup; lost to serbia and tied colombia and mexico in friendlies; tied jamaica and canada and lost to panama at gold cup; lost to germany and TnT in recent games.
i did leave out some Ws in there, but scattered. but it’s generally rubbish form. which the “form” folks then ignore. there have been periods when this team didn’t lose a game for 12-13 months.
we haven’t traveled well in years. and we used to have more success in big name friendlies.
if i wanted to get to what i really think, this coach is sufficient rubbish he took us to 3rd place with the best talent pool ever at one of the weakest regional ebbs in recent memory. like CR and mexico were old, TnT hollowed out, and canada somehow became the class of the region with a handful of good players. the regional results last world cup (as well as some of the pattern above including germany) suggest regional weakness compared to the rest of the world, something regional play hides, and i think the jamaica, panama, and TnT results suggest the pack is catching back up regionally. they have figured out the scam.
Germany also just lost 2-0 to Austria today.
Ghana also lost to Comoros today.
JR: this is one thing i learned in college was check back in a few weeks and re-assess what the meaning of that particular game was. a win feels good in the moment then you check back in and the team you beat can’t win against their grandmother’s team. or sometimes you beat a ranked team and you did a good job. but to get an overall sense……struggled through winter and spring. struggled through gold cup. struggled through the fall. the high point being a couple ok asian friendlies and the NL finals. and i have pointed out how if you want you can ride that same meh form chart all the way back to spring 2022, perhaps even the last qualifier.
the NL finals this looked like a different team. and was under a different coach. to me it’s this coach is very hitched to a way we’re gonna play and a specific set of players. we need to troubleshoot how to get better. he is the wrong person to start with to get under the hood. he’s gonna tell you his brand of car is the best and it comes with the finest parts. he isn’t the guy to look under there and pull bad spark plugs and tighten things that got loose and question his own previous choices.
he tinkered with the formation, which worked well. he undid it. he reconsidered jedi with lund, who played well. he has now rehabilitated jedi. this is not the guy to evolve a team forward.
“With the right coach we would be able to pick players solely from MLS and Eredivisie AND CRUSH THIS TEAM. ”
And that would have proved what exactly?
That we were the better bet to advance than TNT?
No shit.
You see this as a pissing contest. I see this as just another checkpoint to get through before they let you board the plane.
They got through airport security. They now don’t get together for another 4 months during which time the whole team could radically change……..or not.
If you want to flash your muscles and prove you belong with the big guys then
you don’t do it indirectly by scoring lots of goals against weaklings.
You do it by beating those big time teams when you face them for real. Like beating a Holland in the World Cup for example. Until you pass that test everything else is just masturbation.
“And that would have proved what exactly? “
that our program is moving in the right direction and that we are on a trajectory to compete with top teams in the world
“You see this as a pissing contest. I see this as just another checkpoint to get through before they let you board the plane “
which is one of the dumbest comments so far which seems to applaud mediocrity. We are trying to be the best we can be, take our program to the next level and not just “trying to get by” or “take what we can get” so we can be humiliated down the road.
“If you want to flash your muscles and prove you belong with the big guys then you don’t do it indirectly by scoring lots of goals against weaklings”
Another clueless comment. How do you expect to take on a “heavy weight” when you cannot convincingly take down a feather weight (with proper fundamentals and basic structure). like what logic are you using??
With the talent pool we have and the amount of players the US has playing in top league around the world, no team in CONCACAF (with the exception of a few) let alone a Trinidad team playing with home based players, should not be an issue
bizzy,
“that our program is moving in the right direction…”
By beating TNT?? That’s not how international soccer works. In fact that is not how soccer works.
” and that we are on a trajectory to compete with top teams in the world”
The USMNT may be on that trajectory but it has little to do with anything they are doing and it may take longer that everyone thinks.
“which is one of the dumbest comments so far which seems to applaud mediocrity. We are trying to be the best we can be, take our program to the next level and not just “trying to get by” or “take what we can get” so we can be humiliated down the road.”
I’ve been hearing that shit for almost 34 years. I got over it after we did not win the World Cup in 2010 like they planned.
It’s delusional. National soccer teams are made of players borrowed from their clubs , players whose lives ,development and training routines are beyond the control of their national team mangers.
These managers have these players for a very brief amount of time and almost always with lots of time between get togethers. Most high level athletes are creatures of habit and routine. National teams pretty much are about, to a greater or lesser degree depending on the individual, disrupting a player’s habits and routines and then putting them together with different players, coaches, tactics and competitions, etc. It’s actually a miracle that these guys line up correctly for the team picture.
Progressive improvement over time does happen but it is not always evident and it isn’t always in the areas you want it to be.
“How do you expect to take on a “heavy weight” when you cannot convincingly take down a feather weight (with proper fundamentals and basic structure). like what logic are you using??”
You’re kidding right? Argentina lost to Saudia Arabia in Qatar but got out of their group and won the World Cup. In South Africa in 2010 Spain lost their opener 1-0 to Switzerland, got out of the Group anyway and won the World Cup.
And, in case you forgot, the USMNT did “convincingly take down” TNT. We are going to Copa America and they may not. Which was the whole point of this little two game set.
The two games with TNT were actually one game spread over two locations which is what happens in all tournaments where it is home and away with aggregate scoring and away goals counting double in event of aggregate ties.
The USMNT won the first “half” 4-0 and TNT won the second half 2-1 with the USMNT winning the whole thing 5-2, a pretty respectable score. But I guess you forgot that.
“With the talent pool we have and the amount of players the US has playing in top league around the world, no team in CONCACAF (with the exception of a few) let alone a Trinidad team playing with home based players, should not be an issue. ”
Oh please, lower ranked teams beat higher ranked teams a fair amount. Besides, our talent pool is mediocre. In terms of Top 5 leagues, Pulisic and Musah finally became regular starters just this season. Weston is a regular starter, for now, maybe. Matt just lost his job at Forest. Scally seems to be a regular at BMG, Jedi and Timmy are Rocks with Fulham. Flo starts with Monaco but is in a rut at the moment. Chris Richards is an insurance policy at Palace.
If that is your idea of an impressive list, you are easily impressed.
It will be getting better but right now, it is a mediocre list. Compare it to a B team that Argentina or France can field right now.
Tyler may come back or he may not. Brenden is lucky to be playing at all. Weah starts and breaks down, starts and breaks down.
You can huff and puff about how great we are supposed to be. but it is a mediocre group led by a mediocre manager hired by a mediocre organization.
The fish stinks from the head.
“By beating TNT?? That’s not how international soccer works. In fact that is not how soccer works.”
Thats EXACTLY how tournament soccer works. If you dont have you s@#$ together against Trinidad…. You sure as hell not going to have a CHANCE to merely even compete against the likes of France, England, Spain etc.
“The USMNT may be on that trajectory but it has little to do with anything they are doing and it may take longer that everyone thinks. “
Wrong again. It has everything to do with the measurement of progress, and we measure progress by:
Figure Out Your WHYs. Nothing is static. …
1. Establish Tangible Goals: when the program be in X number of years
2. Create Your Game Plan: Strategies, tactics, training
3. PROPER EXECUTION OF THAT GAME PLAN!!!!!!
4. Practice Reflection as You Progress: act on lessons learned and try not to make the same mistakes
5. Celebrate Your Achievements.
It is absolutely foolish to think that a team like T&T, with HOME BASED PLAYERS no less, that knock us out of the world cup IS STILL GIVING US PROBLEMS NOW and is not a big problem…..with the player pool we have
“It’s delusional. National soccer teams are made of players borrowed from their clubs , players whose lives ,development and training routines are beyond the control of their national team mangers “
Absolutely not true. National teams are the best the country has to offer (in there particular area of expertise) and are gathered together to do a job….. Talent pool, proper training and precise execution is fundamental to being at the top of the game. Team members need to practicing and properly understand the coaches (a terrible plan = terrible results) directives to become the best they can be. The training sharpened their skills for their designated roles and their efforts manifested in how the teams executed their plays. Simple
“You’re kidding right? Argentina lost to Saudia Arabia in Qatar but got out of their group and won the World Cup. In South Africa in 2010 Spain lost their opener 1-0 to Switzerland, got out of the Group anyway and won the World Cup.”
How many times do you think Argentina lose to Saudia Arabia….or Spain to Switzerland?? That the beauty of tournament Soccer….. even as a world elite you can win 98% of the time but there is always that 2% chance that an upset could occur. T&T embarassed us and knocked us out of a World Cup and just beat our A-team …….with players from their T&T league and you dont see an issue!!!!
“And, in case you forgot, the USMNT did “convincingly take down” “
did you what the same games I watches. In the first win the goals didnt come till after the 80th minute (AGAINST T&T???) and the second game we were defeated….that is not convincing at all what so ever
The USMNT has the best talent pool its ever had and regardless of what you think……minnows of CONCACAF should not be an obstacle to get by in order to compete in major competitions that matter. If its happening then there is a problem
bizzy,
“By beating TNT?? That’s not how international soccer works. In fact that is not how soccer works.”
Thats EXACTLY how tournament soccer works. If you dont have you s@#$ together against Trinidad…. You sure as hell not going to have a CHANCE to merely even compete against the likes of France, England, Spain etc.”
?? I don’t know if you noticed but in this tournament, the Nations League? the USMNT just advanced to the semis and also clinched a spot in Copa America. TNT now faces an uncertain fate.
So WTF are talking about?
“The USMNT may be on that trajectory but it has little to do with anything they are doing and it may take longer that everyone thinks. “
Wrong again. It has everything to do with the measurement of progress, and we measure progress by:
Figure Out Your WHYs. Nothing is static. …
1. Establish Tangible Goals: when the program be in X number of years
2. Create Your Game Plan: Strategies, tactics, training
3. PROPER EXECUTION OF THAT GAME PLAN!!!!!!
4. Practice Reflection as You Progress: act on lessons learned and try not to make the same mistakes
5. Celebrate Your Achievements.
It is absolutely foolish to think that a team like T&T, with HOME BASED PLAYERS no less, that knock us out of the world cup IS STILL GIVING US PROBLEMS NOW and is not a big problem…..with the player pool we have ”
bizzy, that is a load of excess BS. The USMNT plays in FIFA tournaments not Olympics figure skating events where scoring still has style points.
The way you win games is you score one more goal than they do.
You tie by scoring the same number of goals as they do.
Nothing else is relevant including that list you just ran off.
.
“It’s delusional. National soccer teams are made of players borrowed from their clubs , players whose lives ,development and training routines are beyond the control of their national team mangers “
Absolutely not true. National teams are the best the country has to offer (in there particular area of expertise) and are gathered together to do a job….. Talent pool, proper training and precise execution is fundamental to being at the top of the game. Team members need to practicing and properly understand the coaches (a terrible plan = terrible results) directives to become the best they can be. The training sharpened their skills for their designated roles and their efforts manifested in how the teams executed their plays. Simple”
bizzy you’re grasping at straws there.
Of course the players are the best from a given countries player pool. But, what I said was these people are not your players. You’re borrowing them and that means Gregg has limited control over them and very little exposure to them prior to games in comparison to what it would be like if they were playing for a club team that Gregg managed.
“You’re kidding right? Argentina lost to Saudia Arabia in Qatar but got out of their group and won the World Cup. In South Africa in 2010 Spain lost their opener 1-0 to Switzerland, got out of the Group anyway and won the World Cup.”
How many times do you think Argentina lose to Saudia Arabia….or Spain to Switzerland?? That the beauty of tournament Soccer….. even as a world elite you can win 98% of the time but there is always that 2% chance that an upset could occur. T&T embarassed us and knocked us out of a World Cup and just beat our A-team …….with players from their T&T league and you dont see an issue!!!!”
You are deflecting like all good BS politicians do. Like I said, you keep ignoring that the USMNT advanced in this tournament. Results matter. They allow you to keep playing more games. That is what keeps a program alive.
“And, in case you forgot, the USMNT did “convincingly take down” “
did you what the same games I watches. In the first win the goals didnt come till after the 80th minute (AGAINST T&T???) and the second game we were defeated….that is not convincing at all what so ever”
That game is 90+ minutes long. 180 + in these two legged affairs. It does not matter when you score those winning goals only that you do.
The USMNT is going to Copa America. TNT? maybe. To me that is very convincing.
“The USMNT has the best talent pool its ever had and regardless of what you think……minnows of CONCACAF should not be an obstacle to get by in order to compete in major competitions that matter. If its happening then there is a problem”
That’s how Bruce Arena saw it. You remember Bruce don’t you? The guy who showed up in Couva planning his line up for the opener in the 2018 World Cup in Russia. You and he should compare notes.
By the way, it doesn’t matter if “The USMNT has the best talent pool its ever had”. If that is true, and it is not, it is true only in relation to PAST USMNT talent pools.
I have news for you the 2023 USMNT is not going to play the 2014 USMNT or the 2010 USMNT for anything, anytime soon..
In Copa America the USMNT will face teams like the CURRENT World Cup champs ,Argentina. They need to figure out how to handle the likes of Leo Messi not Landon Donovan.
You keep measuring the USMNT against the 2002, 2006,2010 or the 2014 WC teams.
I measure the current USMNT vs teams like Argentina, Brazil, Uruguay, Peru, Chile, etc. because that is who the USMNT could be facing soon and we better figure out how to deal with that.
Vacqui,
” I don’t know if you noticed but in this tournament, the Nations League? the USMNT just advanced to the semis and also clinched a spot in Copa America. TNT now faces an uncertain fate.
So WTF are talking”
Mediocre at its best. Just because the US men’s national team got through does not mean there isn’t a problem tactically and structurally with the team. With the resources that US soccer have, the level of talent in our pool and the budget they have towards this beautiful game, we are supposed to be further along the improvement lane than we are right now. It is absolutely mind-blowing that You only see the part where they go on to the next round but not the fact that if they keep playing the way they are, they will be embarrassed or severely limited and how far they can go in the competition by moving on without really dwelling on the lessons learned from these past atrocious showings
“bizzy, that is a load of excess BS. The USMNT plays in FIFA tournaments not Olympics figure skating events where scoring still has style points.”
Again, you do not grasp the concept of being a force to be reckoned with on the world stage of soccer. You just think these mediocre games that we happen to scrape by to get a point to advance is all that is needed and you are surprised when we go up against top European contingents and get embarrassed. US soccer is repeating the same mistakes and that happens to be struggling with Minos in CONCACAF…. In other words, they are not showing the vast improvement that we all know the players on the team are capable of. You talk of the fact that we made it through to the semis and you will be the same one to start critiquing the team when we play poorly in the semis and are not out with our heads held down…… Well, the critique is supposed to come in the beginning to change and restructure things, to highlight the errors and learn from the poor play, formation and tactics
“bizzy, that is a load of excess BS. The USMNT plays in FIFA tournaments not Olympics figure skating events where scoring still has style points.”
It shows you do not know what you’re talking about. With that kind of mindset, the US men’s national team will lose against every major opposition in the top 15 FIFA rankings….. Because we don’t have star players that score giving few opportunities. That can only work against mino teams in the region, not against top world opposition. When it comes to US soccer we need to be kinda like Japan and come up with a formation and game plan, structurally and tactically, that fits the play pool we have and not just throw the kitchen sink at something and hope something works or sticks. With a particular sport where we are not even in the top 10 rankings of the world, we need to be on our best and sharp at all times to even meet baseline, let alone win against the elites of the world.
I am not deflecting….. I’m merely trying to highlight the fact that just because we moved on to the semis doesn’t mean we are where we need to be. You are stuck on advancing and not worried about the way we looked and played getting there. And you will be the same one to start critiquing the team. When we have a poor showing against team we meet down the road. The name of the game is to fix the problem now.
“In Copa America the USMNT will face teams like the CURRENT World Cup champs ,Argentina. They need to figure out how to handle the likes of Leo Messi not Landon Donovan.”
My point exactly. How are you going to be able to play against the caliber of players …… The Argentinians, the Colombians the Brazilians….. And yet you can’t have a smooth and convincing win against home-based players of Trinidad and Tobago. Like how? With my analogy I told you before. What hopes do you have of knocking down a heavyweight when you can’t even convincingly dispose of a featherweight??????
“I measure the current USMNT vs teams like Argentina, Brazil, Uruguay, Peru, Chile, etc.”
That is the very definition of you trying to fly and haven’t properly learned how to walk….. You’re thinking about playing top opposition when you can’t even structure the team to have convincing and successful results against CONCACAF teams. Not dotting your “I’s” and crossing your “T’s” against less formidable opponents only means a knockout from more elite competition. And at this point and with the player pool we have, we should at least be a formidable opponent (not champs. Just a force to be reckoned with) in the world of soccer.
In any sport whatsoever, if you struggle against weak opposition, you are most certainly going to struggle or be knocked out or be eliminated against top elite players or teams. And that’s a fact
bizzy,
You’re trying to create a pissing contest but you’re out of urine.
You got nothing, no pot to piss in.
Point out to me where I said the USMNT, having advanced, meant they had no problems.
You can’t because I never have.
Advancing in a tournament doesn’t mean you have worked out all your problems.
But it does mean you have a chance to work on them in a great learning environment that teaches painful lessons, the kind that actually stick with you.
Failure to advance puts a big damper on that “improvement” thing.
So getting past TNT is a very good thing, even though you’ve failed to notice because that would deflect from your propaganda initiative.
You’re too busy pointing out what a shit job Gregg has done. As if you’re the only one who has noticed.
Guess what? You’re in the same group as about 98-99.5 % of the entire fan base.
There is nothing timely or original in your stance. You’ve got a ton of torches and pitchforks marching to Frankenstein’s castle along with you. You’re too bizzy propagandizing your condescending narrative, spouting out a bunch of boilerplate cliche’s about winning teams and all those self evident cliches.
Like IV, y’all think you have this huge soccer IQ and that you’ve noticed things we, the great unwashed, have failed to see because y’all are so much smarter than the rest of us chickens.
Me, I’ve posted many times over the last five or so years, that I wanted Gregg fired in 2019 after the “search for width “Gold Cup fiasco. He showed his basic flaws then. He’s improved some but he’s not likely to improve enough to where anyone will be able to say that he is the best manager to take these guys into 2026.
As for the players, the USMNT player pool is young and talented with more potential than they have had in the past.
But right now, that is all it is, potential.
That’s another way of saying they aren’t there yet.
And they may never be.
These guys, Gregg’s team, as a team, are proven, certified mediocrities.
From Gregg’s first day in December of 2018, the USMNT has played no one in a competitive game who were equal or better than them and thus were never tested. I had hopes for Mexico but they have been going through their own transition.
The Mexicans can give the USSF a run for their money in terms of fuck uped-ness but we’re Americans and I’m confident we have them beat in that category.
The first time Gregg’s charges came up against an equal or better team in competitive circumstances was England in the World Cup. They tied them and later lost to Louie and his Orange A-Holes (ask Robben, Arjen about that).
AFTER 5 years and 66 games, this edition of the USMNT have YET to beat a better or equal team in competitive circumstances. I think we have a pretty good idea of who Gregg and his guys are at this point. They are pretty mediocre. They did as almost as well as the 2014, the 2010 WC teams, better than the 2006 WC team and worse than the 2002 team. I rank them below 2014 and 2010 because both teams had a chance to win their knockout games while Gregg was not in any danger of beating Louie VG and his boys.
That makes them fourth out of five teams and makes them pretty mediocre.
And now they could be facing a bunch of seriously better teams in Copa America. There probably won’t be a Wales or an Iran. There is a good chance the USMNT gets humiliated and embarrassed. CONMEBOL teams are not only more skilled but they are a lot dirtier than what the USMNT is used to so it’s good the USMNT got in some practice playing with 10 men.
Our best players are largely anonymous when compared to equivalent players on the real-World Cup contenders.
They are led by a manager who only Ronniet, maybe, bless his positive heart, is convinced is the best manager available.
You could have replaced Gregg at any point in the last 3-4 years with little if any negative consequence. It might have even made the team better, maybe.
And that is still true. I’d be happy to replace him at this writing. The only thing is, I don’t want his likely replacement, Jason Kreis, the “other” JK.
That would get the USMNT relegated.
But Gregg getting us past TNT? That was a good thing. And he was right to give Tillman an extended run out. That’s my one Gregg compliment for the year.
Vacqui,
“Point out to me where I said the USMNT, having advanced, meant they had no problems.”
Hmmmmm…..well lets see while I was highlighting the problem you were defending the performance
You meant it here:
“You see this as a pissing contest. I see this as just another checkpoint to get through before they let you board the plane. They got through airport security. They now don’t get together for another 4 months during which time the whole team could radically change……..or not.
HENCE BY BLOWING BY THE CHECKPOINT AND NOT CONCERN ABOUT THAT ENTER POINT
You meant it here:
“If you want to flash your muscles and prove you belong with the big guys then
you don’t do it indirectly by scoring lots of goals against weaklings.”
IN OTHER WORDS THE THERE WAS NO ISSUE WITH THE WAY WE PLAYED
You meant it here:
“I don’t know if you noticed but in this tournament, the Nations League? the USMNT just advanced to the semis and also clinched a spot in Copa America. TNT now faces an uncertain fate. So WTF are talking about?
WE SHOULD BE TALKING ABOUT THE FACT THAT THE PERFORMANCE WAS NOT OK AND THAT THERE IS CAUSE FOR CONCERN
You meant it here:
“bizzy, that is a load of excess BS. The USMNT plays in FIFA tournaments not Olympics figure skating events where scoring still has style points.The way you win games is you score one more goal than they do. You tie by scoring the same number of goals as they do. Nothing else is relevant including that list you just ran off.
IN OTHER WORDS ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS SCORE…..NOTHING ELSE IS RELEVANT. STRATEGY, TACTICS, APPROACH, METHOD OF EXECUTION…..NOTHING
You meant it here:
“Like I said, you keep ignoring that the USMNT advanced in this tournament. Results matter. They allow you to keep playing more games. That is what keeps a program alive.”
ACCORDING TO YOU STANDARD OF PLAY, LEVEL OF EXECUTION AND QUALITY OF PLAY ARE IRRELEVANT. IN OTHER WORD, ACCORDING TO YOU IT’S OK TO BARELY GET BY T&T HOME BASE PLAYERS IN ANY WAY WE CAN AND JUST KEEP IT MOVING
So yes if you are not for something or opposed to it…. means you are against it. You literally come on here JUST TO BE THE OPPOSITION to people’s perspective and almost write a book on YOUR opinion (like it means anything) and you say me and other on here LIKE TO ACT LIKE WE HAVE a high soccer IQ. hahaha…..Or maybe you just like to hear yourself regurgitate a whole bunch of nonsense there try to innocently revert to saying “Point out to me where I said the USMNT, having advanced, meant they had no problems.”…..when thats what the whole discussion is about in the first place
“Like IV, y’all think you have this huge soccer IQ and that you’ve noticed things we, the great unwashed, have failed to see because y’all are so much smarter than the rest of us chickens.”
hmmm……That sounds like a Personal problem….lol. FYI…..nobody thinks anything special about themselves (unless maybe you!) as far as interpreting the games. Or maybe that’s how YOU see it and YOU are projecting those insecurities with you long comments and swallow facts because NO ONE ON HERE claims to know it all. Many on here just love the beautiful game and have a platform to collectively discuss how we feel or our perspective.
bizzy,
That’s pretty thin bizzy.
Like I said, you got nothing.
Never easy to play away in concacaf, and this was typical of an away concacaf wcq match. That said, we were well in control until dest got himself sent off. And the second half is where Berhalter may have lost me for good. Trying to give him a pass for subbing Reyna since his minutes load were probably about up. But in second half when we were scored on, and then completely lost control of the game, Berhalter did…nothing. Nothing! Look I’m just a youth coach but I guarantee I could have made that second half more comfortable for us, probably with a single sub by taking off a striker (Balogun!) and sticking someone else who can defend in the middle. It’s not rocket science. And I would have done it at least at halftime, if not immediately after going down to 10. But I was sure after we went down 1-2, he would do it. And then after they almost scored again, but nope. Just same ol same ol. Luckily they couldn’t finish, but their chances were there, maybe enough to overturn what I thought was an insurmountable lead. Unforgivable not to use subs to get that game back, not to mention unnecessarily making guys go 90 after playing down a man. Don’t get it.
one of the oft-overlooked aspects of couva 2017 (setting aside his anti german thing) was the arrogant roster arena took down there, such that about the only bench card he had left to play when we went down 2-0 was dempsey. which got him 1 goal back and he needed 2. he had guzan, a bunch of backs, wondo, bedoya, benny, acosta, mccarty. he had no other real attacking cards to play. i kind of think he expected to be where GB was at the red? up 1-0 and milking it. and we even see how that went.
anyhow, i moaned about this call sheet. people didn’t care or made fun of me. but when you go down 2-1 and have 10 people, it matters if you have both pepi, reyna, and balogun already on; and in reserve tillman, zendejas, baby aaronson, and paredes. he put on tillman which was almost like for like given where he was used game 1. he had a bunch of DM and backs. he’d blown up weston calling him hurt. it’s the goofy games where the call sheet gets on the phone and says hi. oh, crap, that’s what i have left? down 2-1 down to 10?
but to me it’s even worse. we get the red we’re up 1-0. he had a goal to work with and rapidly frittered that away. the 432 didn’t work. he didn’t react. as you say, it snowballed. dest messed him over but this is what you get paid to do. the US was down to NINE MEN in 2006 world cup AGAINST ITALY and managed a tie. but that game was handled like a WAR.
i keep repeating it, this team isn’t sure if it wants to battle for 90 or run up and down the field and score goals. when you get in a game like last night you need to know what you are and have a no-panic plan B. this was like they were so angry after what dest did, they all but quit. there was no adjustment. you are up 1-0, this may or may not be winnable, but it should be tie-able. you put in scally immediately. you park the bus til half. and then you put out a 441 of battlers and dare TnT to do a thing about it. we went up and down the field with them 432 like naive children and got shown up for doing it. this should be better run than a parent-coached U14 team.
The issue wasn’t “oh crap who do I put in down 2-1”, that we can win shipped sailed when you gave up the 2nd. At that point its when Maloney should have come on and protected the aggregate. You gave up playing pretty when you took off your best player leaving a gaping void in midfield for Trinidad to exploit. Second, you should have never tried a two striker formation when you only brought two strikers.
————————————
Scalley for a striker, Gio off at half for Maloney (if minutes were restricted) 4-4-1 it shouldn’t have been hard. See out the draw and maybe get Pepi doing his Groningen act from last year and score one on four and steal a victory. Instead you let DLT get run over repeatedly and only put Maloney on in added time.
JR: sorry, but that’s reactive. good coaches are proactive. my impression was he tried to stay attacking, gave up 2 goals, says oh crap, starts putting on defense to protect his eroding aggregate.
to me with a 4 goal margin you don’t need ANY more goals. you park the bus. you don’t kvetch and whine that you wanted to keep attacking TnT monday. GB acted like a pouty coach who wanted another 3-0 win and was still chasing it despite reality.
no, you do the adult thing and firm it up. 441, put in some legbreakers. if it goes perfect WE WIN THAT GAME 1-0. worst case scenario they have to work very hard to manage any goals they get.
but to do that the system evangelist has to drop his aesthetic driven ideas and tell a team to just tackle and clear for 90. we are being taught a lesson even if the lesson doesn’t apply on monday.
To all those who still defend GGG and put the blame on the players I ask: what is the tipping point that will convince you that perhaps this is not the coach best suited to get the most of what is without the shadow of a doubt the most talented US squad ever?
Now that we are in Copa America that will be a good litmus test. Can GGG do better than Klinsy did with an inferior squad (and klinsy did it outside of the US too!). If he does then I’ll come eat crow, and happily so! I he doesn’t then that’s a sign the program is not progressing at all and a change needs to happen before we blow a historic opportunity with the deepest USMNT talent pool ever playing the WC at home in 2026.
The lackluster way we qualified for Qatar and the unimpressive performance we had in the tournament 1 win 2 draws 1 loss, including being outclasses in the round of 16 did nothing to justify rehiring the same national team coach.
I sincerely wish Greg can figue it out and have the team be as successful as the talent within deserves to be. I really do. But by the same token at what moment do we accept he can’t and we need to try something new?
The 2026 WC is out best shot at making the semis. Which has to be the target. Anything less is a failure, sorry. Let’s not mess around and let’s be pragmatic for once.
By Klinsy did it outside of US I mean he had some notable wins on the road including vs italy if I recall correctly.
Did Klinsmann ever do it in an actual match? I’m not disagreeing that the Berhalter 2.0 is floundering just as it moves away from the dock. But those JK wins were generally by caring a lot more about a friendly than the opponent.
JR
The 2014 World Cup were all away games. Brazil is a foreign country.
They played very well there.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
In many ways Copa America is a tougher tournament than the WC for the USMNT even at home. CONMEBOL teams are more “pragmatic” than our All American red white and blue good guys are used to.
They know how to get under the skin of such softies. Forget about Dest. In 2016 Copa America the USMNT had three different players get red carded.
Mat, there are like 3 people on this site that ever make any attempts to defend Berhalter; me, JR, and RonnieT. All of us have said multiple times we didn’t want him to be rehired. My answer to you is I will never blame a coach for players playing terrible because that is outside of their control. I will blame a coach for playing people in bad positions, tactics, player selection, poor roster selections which are things they have control over. For instance starting Brendan Aaronson, not subbing him out, playing with 2 fwds when you are down a man and have the lead, not getting Tillman on the field at the start of the 2nd half. Another example is not taking Landon Donovan to the WC because you don’t like him even though he would have helped the team. Another example is not subbing Jonathon Bornstein out after giving up two goals to let Mexico back in a game and then watching him give up another 2 to lose 4-2. Incidentally, COPA was in the US when Klinsman coached, not SA so it will actually be a very good comparison. The 2002 WC team had Freidel, Pope, Hejduk, Reyna, Mathis, O’brien, Donovan, and McBride, and Eddie Lewis. Those were pretty good players; not sure I agree this is the best US team ever.
Tele57 – The current is surely not the best “team” since that ranking is based on actual game results and performance. In my book this current squad has yet to prove they can be a decent “team”.
The 2002 guys you mention were talented sure – but really our current batch just has more talent and more of the current team plays in top Euro leagues, as well. But again the 2002 bunch was more of a team -though let us not forget we got lucky to get through to the round of 16 so it’s not like they were unstoppable either. Less talent but better team still.
Today we have guys starting in AC Milan and Juventus. A striker who was a top 5 scorer in a top tier Euro league and a slew of others playing in strong teams in Europe. It’s just a different level of skill and talent. But yet to prove to be a team.
So for me the talent is sufficiently there so if we’re not performing something is not right at the leadership level and preventing us from reaching our potential.
mat: that is such a tautology. the ranks sucks ergo the team sucks. my theory is every roster of players has a range of outcomes dictated by coaching, injuries, and luck. on paper this should be better than it is. there is a reason people talked “semis.” this is simply not the coach to accomplish that.
Klinsey isn’t even the best Copa America comparison. In 1995 under Steve Freaking Sampson the US won their group (and kicked ARG butt in the process) won in the quarter finals and only went out 1-0 in the semifinals against Brazil.
The fact is that in the 1990s when the US rebirth in soccer was in its infancy we placed just as highly in tournaments as we do today, beat more top opponents in official matches than we do today, all with far less than we have today. I fear our golden generation will soon turn into the wasted generation.
my 2 cents what got lost was defensive soccer. you look at this team from roughly bora to bradley and it was founded on tenacious defense. that negates the best teams in the world on any given sunday. that wins you games like last night. klinsi’s first cycle and GB this has diverted into naive rubbish.
sit back, defend in numbers, win the ball, run at them with pulisic and reyna, and play weah, balogun, and pepi behind defenses on the counter. very little about this team screams naively press high and play half court soccer and cross balls in all night. we cannot find our 9 and we are in dumb shapes to defend right.
dest can’t do what he did and keep a job but he barely has to fight anyone off to keep his post.
and people will cry that i am proposing kickball. i am not saying we should or shouldn’t play over the top some. i think we could play plenty on the floor. what i think is this should be about defense first and should be more pragmatic both sides of the ball. and use our speed in the attack and set up the offense where pepi and balogun are involved more.
personally i find the rush to say any counter system would turn into kickball exposes the aesthetic complaints posing as soccer ones. you have folks more concerned this is pretty than this wins games. this is part of who wants klinsi or GB. and this doesn’t work. we are not there yet with the technical players like reyna. we continue to have athletes and people willing to get stuck in. go back to athletic soccer.
if people are going to pout about it i said over and over around the world cup time that france, morocco, japan, and other teams were happy to play an athletic speed game. morocco and japan in particular defended more like mid-block and then burst forward after swarming opposing attackers. i am convinced the critics are thinkng about decade old US teams or still stuck on how much they hated bob bradley. until you figure out your snob systems bob bradley had better teams than you folks can muster. so either improve your system past this rubbish or move out the way and let the defend-and-counter folks bring in common sense. we aren’t going to win the world cup on skill. we might compete defending and poaching goals with the assorted athletic attacking talent we do have.
Of course then Steve Sampson had one of the most pathetic world cups.
Mat,
How long have you been following the Gregg rein of error?
If you think he has any real fans then you have not been paying attention.
The most fervent defense of Gregg I have seen on those pages goes like this:
1. The job is hard, really hard. I mean really, really hard. It’s so unfair how hard it is.
2. Player injuries are unfair and deprive Gregg of his first choice lineups all the time. How unfair.
3. The Reynas were mean to him so we should have hired him back just as an FU to the Reynas and their diva shitbag son.
I haven’t seen people here saying he is the person who more than any other will get the most out of our young talent.
Gregg is still here because when he was hired I’m convinced it was a two cycle plan. If he made Qatar then he would be given a shot at continuing to build on his CLUB USMNT project.
The casual observer will note that Gregg himself lacked experience but the target is 2026 and I believe the USSF figured Greg would just learn on the job using Qatar and now Copa America as workshops to edumacate Gregg himself..
Why Gregg?
1. Price point
2. No one likes the whole hiring and firing process. Once every 8 years is enough for the USSF.
3. Everyone hated JK and didn’t want their precious little clubhouse upset by another pushy, mouthy know it all furriner.
4. They expected to be inundated with waves of young world class players , coming out of MLS academies, moving to Europe and then taking over all the Top 5 clubs and the Champions League. You can see for yourself how that worked out
5. Suspected nepotism. Sure Jay Berhalter supposedly claims he wasn’t involved in the hiring but does anyone really believe that? And besides, as we’ve seen in the Reyna gate scandal, does anyone believe that professionalism is held in high regard at the USSF? Right.
6. An inability to attract suitable alternative candidates. You’ve seen how the USSF works. Would you want to work for these clowns if you were any kind of half decent manager? Throw money at them? Yeah but I’ll believe they have the money when I see it. Sure if Klopp or someone like that were really interested the funds could be found but you have to get a Klopp interested first.
Right now the USSF have the manager that they deserve.
There are endless reasons to fire Gregg but this TNT two legged affair isn’t one of them,
since USSF/GB/surrounding sycophants seem to like to pretend to be “solving” old problems, such as being more competitive on the world stage, i wanna say when i ran the stats at a point, our peak ppg and road form in qualifying were in the 2000s (just like 2002 was the only time we made the quarters). i think we lost to TnT ONCE in about 14 years from 1994-2008. for a long time there, if we lost an away CONCACAF game, it was to Mexico or CR, and that’s about it. that has increased to guatemala, panama, trinidad. you can look it up, this downturn started under klinsi, arena, and only somewhat improved in the ’22 qualifying cycle,, where the team tended to be schizo home and away.
i think the fact we play so many home games hides things. our road form hasn’t caught up to the era when the US moved on to the quarters. personally i “pin” it to klinsi, for his first cycle scouting/dual national chops, had similarly naive tactics. arena then simply didn’t have the players. GB brought the home form back but road remains a mess. every so often we play a tough game and grind something out but not consistently. that is what road wins take.
You just wasted a lot of time, yours and those of us unfortunate enough to have read that post.
it is basic fact we are a weaker ppg and road team than historic US teams c. 1994-2014. period. case you forgot this qualified THIRD last time ON A TIEBREAKER. struggled to get points away (panama, etc.). i personally feel like the continued struggles even after re-loading the personnel c. 2019 reflect the silly naive tactics. this team is built to win home games and run up the score on third-rate opponents. it is not built to grind away results and beat good teams. but that is what wins you tournaments.
IV,
“it is basic fact we are a weaker ppg and road team than historic US teams c. 1994-2014. period. case you forgot this qualified THIRD last time ON A TIEBREAKER. struggled to get points away (panama, etc.).”
So what? You know who finished ahead of the USMNT in the Octagon? Canada(1) and Mexico (2)
Guess what happened in Qatar, IV? Canada and Mexico failed to get out of their groups and the USMNT advanced.
Finishing first and second ahead of the USMNT sure did a lot for those guys, IV.
“i personally feel like the continued struggles even after re-loading the personnel c. 2019 reflect the silly naive tactics…..it is not built to grind away results and beat good teams. but that is what wins you tournaments.”
Really? The winning style your describe does not really fit the personality or skill set of the best players in this player pool, who for all their talent are young and naïve. There is no core of savvy wily vets to support the young ones while they learn the ropes.
This team basically picks itself because the veterans are done for, there is no depth. A better manager than Gregg might have gotten more out of these rosters but Gregg is something of a rookie himself and he’s not very good yet. And he may never be very good.
But he’s not going anywhere and your solutions are mostly naïve and unworkable anyway.
“this team is built to win home games and run up the score on third-rate opponents.”
No, it’s not. What you are implying is lazy bullshit.
The USMNT plays mostly CONCACAF teams and those tournaments are held in the US. The USMNT runs up the score on third rate opponents because Gregg has been in charge for 66 games and most of them are against third rate or second rate opponents.
The USMNT went into Qatar as an untested team because they had not met a team better than them or equal to them in competitive circumstances until they played England in Qatar. And they tied that game. The next time they played a better team in competitive circumstances was when they lost to the Netherlands in Qatar.
what I don’t get from GB is after the red, why was Tillman not back in the second bank of 4? we played a 4 3 1 for a while, just no sense in it, and were lucky not to get dogged on the weak side which was, literally, unmarked for a while after the Dest send off
Malik was right in front of GB, easy to direct him, so either GB didn’t and that is the shape he wanted, or Malik wasn’t following instructions
anyway, that was weird to me
games like these make it easier to understand why the USMNT coaching job is not highly regarded
he wasn’t in the second line so people can pretend he wasn’t basically playing wing last game too. less punchy, GB tends to perseverate rather than adjust and i think he wanted to try 2 strikers this game and we were going to go with it heck or high water even if it’s silly 10 man shape. maybe he thought the 2 men up top would keep the defense honest and make them play around us but then at the lines behind that we’d have fewer people.
Yeah still baffled why Berhalter left both strikers on after going down to 10. Literally makes no sense. Especially after we were getting roasted straight down the middle with their fast players running right through our outnumbered middle bank, as you say. The worst part is that GB either didn’t recognize or refused to act on this until after the 80th minute! Balogun and Pepi were absolutely worthless during the entire second half, not their fault, but our middle was overrun. You get 5 subs Gregg! Use them! Said it before and I’ll say it again, Crocker needs to get GB a “tactical adviser” as an assistant coach for in game adjustments, because GB cannot read a game.
“what I don’t get from GB is after the red, why was Tillman not back in the second bank of 4? we played a 4 3 1 for a while, just no sense in it, and were lucky not to get dogged on the weak side which was, literally, unmarked for a while after the Dest send off”
My guess is Gregg would have preferred to keep Gio on to give them some stability in possession and to keep TNT spread out a little but it was probably prudent to not risk Gio getting hurt either by overuse over the course of two games or by exposing him to over-adrenalized, overeager TNT players.
Tillman was the next best thing and he helped them maintain the semblance of a possession game post Red Card. He helped keep TNT honest. He was also instrumental in wasting time.
I have had “Fire Gregg” on my to do list since 2019 and he’s still on my list but
not for this game, which I found entertaining. Of course, I’m sure the USMNT found it excruciating. This team hasn’t had to face this kind of situation very often. They passed the test. and won the tie 5-2. It was as they say, a “professional performance”.
In baseball some people like home run derbies, some people like pitching duels. I prefer pitching duels.
Unlike most of you I have watched the USMNT for far too long to expect them to play beautiful soccer. But I do expect them to win ugly, if necessary, and they did that here, key word being win.
“games like these make it easier to understand why the USMNT coaching job is not highly regarded”
That’s probably the sanest comment I’ve seen on these two games.
TnT could barely get out of their half game 1 and game 2 we are up 1-0 minutes before half. we are ahead 4-0 on aggregate. i think he got full of himself. i think he wanted 2 forwards chasing people.
coaching 101 at that point is retrench. i don’t remember ever playing 10 men with 2 forwards. you are more worried about shipping goals than scoring them. you look to steal something on a rush. you don’t undermine 10 man defense to have more outlet options……that’s a third order concern. first order is batten the hatches.
IV,
“TnT could barely get out of their half game 1 and game 2 we are up 1-0 minutes before half. we are ahead 4-0 on aggregate.”
That’s because TNT’s players are not very good. Remember that for later. They may have gotten a bit better with a man advantage and being at home but not THAT much better. You may have noticed how their kid forward butchered a breakaway that Ferreira or even Ariolla would have likely scored on. Well maybe not Paul.
” i think he got full of himself. i think he wanted 2 forwards chasing people.”
Nah. That’s just you trying to promote your own silly propaganda brand ” IV is a mind reader” BS.
You’re not a mind reader.
A lot of people have been wanting to see how Pepi with Flo would work together. If you were paying any attention you might have noticed that Flo seemed to drop back a bit and spent more time in midfield something slumping forwards sometimes do.
“coaching 101 at that point is retrench.”
coaching 101 isn’t always right. Another way to play defense, especially against a potent , offensive juggernaut such as those feared TNT forwards, coveted by many Champions League teams I’m sure, is to keep the ball away from them, grind them down by having them chase the ball, which by the way, they were doing all game, and, with any luck maybe add another goal to the aggregate.
The USMNT had a 3 goal lead with 30 minutes to go. Along with a very precious away goal.
In high school, college or with your select teams that may not be a big lead but at the national team level, that’s a huge lead even with 90 minutes to go. It’s much bigger with 30 minutes to go. And that lead gets more impossible to deal with as the clock winds down.
Tillman and Scally, Bundesliga bred, were also diligently wasting time. Tillman’s ability to go into the corner and hold possession contributed greatly to that. This also helps puts a lid on things and slow the game down which hurt TNT and helped the USMNT realize that they still had a 3 goal lead and control of the situation. Even a man down the USMNT is vastly superior and Tillman and Scally were there to remind the their teammates of that. Mostly the guys needed to settle down and just play normally.
What you wanted was for Gregg to panic and that usually doesn’t help.
If TNT did get another goal, Gregg still had a few subs to work with. If he needed to he could have brought in Maloney, Richard and Miles and kept kicking the ball into the stands for 30 minutes, though I will point out that that strategy is not foolproof.
” i don’t remember ever playing 10 men with 2 forwards.”
Flo was playing as a midfielder.
Your personal experience is not necessarily what national teams go by. Maybe they did not do that in high school , college or the select teams you had?
“you are more worried about shipping goals than scoring them.”
Maybe in high school, college, or with your select teams.
But If I’m Gregg? I’m thinking :
“We screwed up letting these guys get this far but we’re a lot better than them. With 30 minutes left, TNT can’t score w/o the ball. And they have to hang back to respect the counter threat that Tillman, Pepi and Flo, working in midfield represent. You know who can’t afford to “ship” another goal? TNT can’t . So fuck them. Gio would have ripped them open but I can’t risk his health. So let’s see if they can handle Tillman. And if they can and he fails, then I still have time and a two goal lead to bring in Maloney, Miles and Richards, our law firm.”
” you look to steal something on a rush. you don’t undermine 10 man defense to have more outlet options……that’s a third order concern. first order is batten the hatches.”
That’s what the book says in high school college and with your select teams. But at the international level, you ain’t going nowhere without taking a risk sometimes. I don’t have your so called superior soccer intellect and I can’t read minds so I don’t know why Gregg did what he did . In this case Gregg took what I see as a pretty manageable risk. You might not take the same approach with a better team like Uruguay but maybe, just maybe Gregg understood that his guys needed to remember how much better than TNT they really were. And of course, that they needed practice in 10 man play, regardless.
So our left back was responsible for 50 percent of the goals scored in two games…. not a good look for our team when Pukisic and Weah are out. Think we learned some things. Still looking for quality attackers if our two best wingers are injured.
U17’s made a game of it against Germany but still lost 3-2. Could never really get Figueroa going during this tournament. But they dominated possession again. Pretty much equal on shots and shots on target with Germany but it’s a concern that you dominate possession but can’t stop teams from shots at goal. You would expect a team that dominates 66 percent possession to not give up so.many shots.
Also I think US soccer may need to start thinking about looking for Berhalter replacement before Copa America. These guys looked much better under Callahan than they have under Berhalter so far.
But in saying that I don’t know if US soccer has the money to pay two salaries during this cycle. Probably stuck with Berhalter. Crocker may have botched this hire. We will see how he does at Copa America. But Berhalters in game subs and tactics still Leaves a lot to be desired.
Definitely will be interesting g if Honduras knock out Mexixo tomorrow. Honduras has a 2-0 lead in the series. Will be a big time slip.up from.Mexixo.
so you’re just gonna overlook that we can’t finish plays off, or that our sense of awareness in front of goal is shit, because none of that is on Greg. We should have been up 2-0, 3-0 easily last night in the first half. Aaronson might have been the most selfish, poorest player on the pitch, how does he not pass to a wide open Pepi in front of a wide open net on his first chance? Hew went on two muff 2 other scoring chances as well, and don’t get me started on ho poor LDLT and Balogun were, but yeah the motto is “it’s Greg’s fault”!
Rt: look up my post on the other thread. what is the “positive” argument for GB? where are the results? where is the pretty play? where is the growing rapport and smoothness? where is the discipline? all i ever hear for the man is either “isolated positive opportunism,” ie, we happen to beat ghana that night, or flat out nihilistic “negative” cases. “who else?” “can we afford it?” “the players let him down.” they let him down 75-80% of nights we either lose or look indifferent? they let him down on the tactics, the adjustments, the weird personnel choices? calling in hurt people? did dest call up mckennie limping around? yes, it is not always entirely GB. but the supposed villain list rotates and is often rehabilitated. reyna was ruining the team, reyna is now the one consistent guy playing well. since the drama on that was him not getting started, who now looks like he definitely should have been (just where TIV had been saying to play him for years, AM/10)?
i get it would cost money but you are watching the 2026 golden generation dreams wither in front of your face and saying do nothing about it.
this is too talented for how it looks and the results it gets. ask nike for $1.6m more and tell them it’s an investment in a better home tournament product.
Amen.
dest lost his mind but i was disappointed only ream seemed to grasp the guy should have been dragged 30 yards away and muzzled.
at a complete loss how dest couldn’t reel it back in given the situation. they implied dest was angry at some other call besides the out of bounds call, anyone know what it was? but anyhow, whatever happened, we’re up 1-0 away and you already got a yellow. to be fair, when i feel messed around on a throw in call i have errantly returned the ball, or mouthed off, and taken the first card. it’s the second that’s inexcusable.
it was like your cat claws you and you go to brush it off and it tries to stay on but claws you all the way down a leg.
Reyna was the first one to try and calm Dest down and separate him from the referee. Dest was upset about a play that occurred up the field and 30 seconds earlier than when the ball was called out of play.
The positives for Greg for me are as follows….he’s the winningest coach in the history of the USMNT, he got the team qualified for the last WC, when the previous regime cycle couldn’t, the team played some attractive soccer in Qatar and we didn’t win more games there because of missed opportunities in front of goal which at this point is silly to keep repeating, but its a thing. He has played the team in various formations to start this cycle and as continued to integrate new faces into the pool, he’s kept the culture strong within the group as evidenced by the number of players that wanted him back. We’ve qualified for Copa America, albeit losing to T&T off the back of an egregious, selfish act by one of our main players, but even the best teams lose to also rans from time to time(if you look across europe some of the bigger teams are losing to minnows but it doesn’t change the strength of the team overall). Listen, Greg isn’t perfect by stretch of the imagination, but he shouldn’t have to be because all I keep hearing is how great this generation of players are, what club teams they play for and Champions League, etc, but then when you look at a lot of these games you see poor play and attitudes from players that are supposed to be game changers. News flash, we have about 3 real difference makers on this team CP, Gio and Jedi. IV brought up that Gio should have started at the WC going off of his performances now with the USMNT, well if Gi hadn’t been injured for months leading up to the WC he would have ben a starter, but injuries to our best players, at the worst time, is wash rinse repeat
Ronnie,
You aren’t defending Gregg. You are just reading off a list of a facts.
And that means do you honestly believe that back in 2018, someone else could not have taken what eventually became the player pool and done as well as Gregg if not better?
Do you think any other manager, not named Pep or Klopp could have taken this bunch and qualified for Qatar?
Or gotten them out of the group and then lose to Louie VG and the Orange? Or won two going on three Nations Leagues in a row? Or molded together what appears to be a nice clubhouse ?
I happen to think that a fair number of other managers could have done that. I think Gregg just squeaked by.
Gregg did and he gets credit for it. It’s all history now.
Has Gregg improved since his hiring ?
Yes he has.
Is that good enough. I don’t know but I doubt it.
Can they get some one better? I don’t know but they should have been keeping a list ready since the day he was rehired.
Because Copa America was out there.
People on SBI generally look down on any soccer outside of Europe and seriously underrate how brutal a tournament Copa America is. After all, many of the best teams in Europe are based around the contributions of these same South Americans .
The point is , even on American soil, Copa America has the potential to make the USMNT look really bad and get Gregg fired or at least spoken to sternly in an unkind way without respect or humility.
It was good they had to play with 10 men for a while because they may well have to do that in Copa America. Back in 2016 they had players red carded in three games. THREE. I don’t know what set off Sergino but you can bet your ass that CONMEBOL managers already noticed this. They already know that Americans do not handle underhanded play by the other team very well and CONMEBOL invented underhanded play.
It would behoove Gregg to make a real good showing at Copa America because he may find it hard to remain in charge if he doesn’t have these guys ready to go when that tournament starts.
Reyna was the first one to try and calm Dest down and separate him from the referee. Dest was upset about a play that occurred up the field and 30 seconds earlier than when the ball was called out of play.
Fuera GGG! USSF saw what exactly to bring the coach back again? More of the same. T&T had chances to get a couple more goals and if you look at 80+ minutes the first game the US did the minimum to get past a team they should blow off the field. Dest is a good player, but does not defend and might be a headcase, leave him out.
GGG’s re-hire was the most uninspiring thing the USSF have done. It shows the USSF brain-trust lacks ambition and does not have a vision to move forward.
Their actions are reactive and just watch they will fire him before 2026 to validate their incompetence.
This is the most talented group assembled, and you play like minnows hoping to get out unscathed.
Even with 10 players, there was no excuse to lose to TNT.
Gregg is basura fuego grande ↘️↘️🚮🚮🚮🚮! Exit the stage🤡 GB the payaso clown
so, it was Greg’s fault that Sergino did the probably the dumbest, most selfish and arrogant thing we’ve ever seen that immediately changed the game? Was Greg at fault for De La Torre, Aaronson and Balogun play poorly. Listen, Greg has his faults, but this aint on him, at the end of the day we qualified comfortably and were going to beat T & T by multiple goals had Dest not did what he did!
Yes, Dest was an idiot and put GGG in a bad spot. However, his substitutions were awful. The only reason to take out Reyna in that situation was because of a minutes limit. Still, you had 2 strikers, take one of them off. He also was late to make other subs, and didn’t use them all. You’re playing with 10 men in the Caribbean. The second half was a slog and they’re lucky Trinidad didn’t score at least 2 more.
Ronnie, I respect your opinion, but the guy just stinks!!!!! In the first game, he can’t even get his team to break down a 10-man T&T. That’s on GB. It’s the same garbage. Go wide and kick crosses. He should be a middle school coach, then. A coach needs a game plan if his side is ever one man down, and he did not even have one. He didn’t make one adjustment. The guy is terrible. His subs are way too late. He just does not know how to make adjustments.
Blah blah Ronnie the Gregg berhalther apologist you always coming at me side was with Weak points rotate off my comment and otate off Gregg’s jock
oh, please, indulge us, i want to hear the actual “positive” case for the man, as opposed to there always being some other scapegoat. yeah, this one is primarily on dest, but he did a horrible job of adjusting to that. and big picture this is a similar results set to what arena managed from the same opponent 6 years ago, underlining the minimal progress.
i am bored with the “onus on you” “negative” case for the man, of “who else,” of “but player x had a bad day,” or talking down our roster which used to be seen as the golden generation.
how many of these 6 games this stint have you been like, wow, this is a well oiled machine that is full of promise. all i hear is excuses. including excuses about the quality of the opponents (and we’re not exactly playing france away), or “sometimes you have to win ugly.” the one dominant game i have seen was ghana and they are a hot mess that lost to mexico and just barely beat madagascar 1-0 at home on a goal 6 minutes into second half injury time. fwiw germany tied mexico and then lost to turkey.
the “negative case” folks will complain at me because this may yet have another round of 16 or so in it. given the talent that is a depressing undershoot of expectations a half decade ago. where is the “positive” case this is going where we once hoped?
i personally think this is all cynically about if you overpay a women’s coach and go with the cheap and third rate GB you can wind up with equal pay. klinsi cost twice what GB does. if we paid the going rate they couldn’t match the salaries. so we went cheap. this is not without consequence. and we pretended we could teach this guy who can’t keep his lessons straight from game to game.
which, to underline something, i know we had people out, but this window proved to have little to do with ghana. we tripped over something. we couldn’t find it again, didn’t seem to be looking — even when TnT seemed more willing to open it up this game we weren’t trying to 4231 them back.
I’ve been on record several times saying that I didn’t want Greg back, but he’s what we got, so continuing to whine about him being coach is futile and childish. What I’m not about to do, which has become common place in our fanbase is make excuses for players that have been propped up because they play for good clubs in europe, but who can’t stay healthy, can’t get sustained minutes at their clubs most times and can’t score goals that are put on a platter. Ya can continue this love affair with #GREGOUT all you want, it’s cute for sure, but it doesn’t change the fact we have an overrated team that continues to beat themselves, and for al of the talk of golden generation and where players play, its comical that there is this insinuation that Greg needs to do everything perfectly from tactics to motivational talks for us to succeed. We can hire whatever manager we want, but it won’t change injuries and ineptitude in front of goal
Rt: who do you think picks — and repicks — the players you see as overrated or under-gamed? to me half the problem is he settled on most of this unit before wales 2020 and has scarcely responded to its lack of success. we do have other options at every line but they are dismissed out of hand as supposedly inferior. who dismisses them? exactly. we then go out there with a set of players who strike me as built to get behind a defense, and instead try and play keepaway and cross balls in.
sorry dude but the women fired their coach for roughly the same level of product that got our coach retained. that’s because they have aspirations they have cashed in on before while we have dreams we don’t know how to actualize. go talk to morocco, japan, or croatia about how to punch above your weight. we seem obsessed with impressing no one with a half cooked version of 433 tactics that is neither offensive fish nor defensive fowl.
what are we trying to do here? when does this turn the corner? this is the best gathering of US talent, ever, it’s just being wasted.
IV, yes this is seemingly the best collection of talent we’ve ever had, but all it is right now is talent, not end product and that is down to the players not getting it done. Greg can’t pass the ball for them, nor can he score goals for them, that wins games not the perfect tactics or motivational speeches. To sit here ad act like you aren’t seen blown chances after blown chances go to waste that could impact results is crazy, it borders on willful ignorance
Someone say Concacaf road games are really hard.
so I can get the rest of the vomit out.
CONCACAF games are really hard. Someone was going to say it so I just thought I’d get it over with.
Summed it up pretty much perfectly and there’s not a lot to add to that.
I have no idea whatsoever why they brought Gregg back. This is what he’s always been. I mean, we’ve known forever that his teams are clunky and he doesn’t adjust well, and he sits for far too long before making subs even when what he’s got out there is patently not working. I’d have made that Lennard Maloney switch for Luca about 20 minutes before Gregg did, for instance. Luca could in no way run with those guys and physically they were just bullying him, and on such an ugly surface his elegant passing and normally crisp technical ability are just not going to be there.
Well, the good news is, we’re into Copa America. The bad news is, if we don’t improve a bunch between now and then we’re not going to be there very long.
Also, kudos to Jedi Robinson. He’s probably been our best player for two straight games now.
Sorry, this was supposed to be a response to Papi Grande.
Q, it is not a highly coveted position. They tried to get other coaches and they weren’t interested. While US fans clamor how great the talent is, there are probably 15 teams in Europe with equal talent and much better depth and that excludes the numerous teams with better talent. That is just Europe. Henry and Vierra both have terrible coaching resumes. I guess you could say they should have picked one of them because they wanted the job but that was probably more a case of the evil you know. There was no one with a proven track record that wanted to coach the team.
Jimmy Conrad, Charlie Davies and Heath Pearce all said on their ISWT podcast that the candidates for the USMNT managerial position were paltry at best! And if that was the case it made sense for them to rehire Berhalter to continue his “plan” for the team, but more importantly he established a good relationship with the team, built a good culture and many of the teams stars wanted him back. Don’t take my word for it though, those facts are in print!
RT: you’re conflating the people willing to play the corporate applications-and-interviews game we wanted with the names who offered themselves up like mourinho. but they wanted what JK got years ago. you sit down with the agent and hammer out a deal in a week. numbers. we seem in fear of an HR lawsuit so we run a process that seemed to result in the fired marsch against the depressing GB. does that sound like the process worked? if that’s who’s willing to send a resume in, send out a USSF exec with a checkbook and hire someone in a week.
Strange not to sub out a striker when you started with 2 of them after a defender gets a red card. But after we scored the goal early it was pretty much game over. Still embarrassing to lose again in Trinidad.
we are rarely in this situation but he has plenty of history “pulling pulisic” so to speak. which is part of why i say i don’t think he understands other than at some clunky elemental level how his offense operates. LDLT is not an adequate stand in for reyna.
i found it odd we pulled a wing to put on an AM and not maloney/scally. like if you think we just put ourselves at risk, pull the attacking wing, you put in a defender or a DM, you park the bus. you make what happened impossible. you clear balls out to half for 90′. he instead seemed to try a 432 that didn’t work. as with the 433 it’s like he has to do the cute thing and not the crude-but-effective bit.
Sometimes it seems like he has no clue, missing obvious needed moves. Here’s one thing that really astounded me. We had a corner kick and the T&T defense kicked it out and they were first to the ball and should have scored a 3rd goal, but the T&T guy screwed up and blew an easy scoring chance. Given that situation, how do you not have a least one player, preferably 2, at the midline to guard against that very thing? It looked like we didn’t have anyone in a “safety” position. Did GB think we really had a chance to score off the corner and that it was important to do so? So many stupid things.
GP: we won a few 10 man soccer games in my day but we played a 352 already premised on getting back, hard physical defense, and counter. you ditch a forward and you try and catch someone on the counter with wide speed. the US right now is an odd odd bird, we have weah and a couple forwards built for tapping in speedy counters, but we instead want to do a slow build and cross it to forwards who aren’t really header people. if you want to win with 10 you need to either be technical studs or fast as heck. some sort of mismatch problem that offsets the numerical disadvantage.
Why on earth did Beerholder take off his best player and ball handler? The front line was awful tonight: no one was able to maintain possession and I simply don’t understand how BA keeps getting called up. I’m rooting for the guy but he hasn’t been playing well for a year.
probably because going a player down was going to require the team to work harder which means more running, thus you take out your most injury prone, and not fully fit player which was Gio.
DC, Reyna was taken off to save a sub and get another defender on the field right away; he was only going to play 45 minutes. Aaronson should have been subbed out after 10 minutes; he disrupted whatever flow there was on offense, lost the ball in dangerous spots repeatedly that led to counters and scoring opportunities for Trinidad, lost every tackle, spent most of the game on the ground, and doesn’t know how to defend, but other than that …. Playing with two fwds when you are down a man and leading didn’t make sense. That is on Gregg and not getting Aaronson off the field is also on Gregg. Dest isn’t on Gregg and players playing bad isn’t either. Tillman was probably the best player for US . Sadly, Dest is a much better player than Scally, but I’m not sure you can bring Dest in anymore. Stupid red card against Mexico and then this; I’m not sure there is a word in the English language to describe that level of stupidity. Every team now knows you can get into his head.
OTOH, Aaronson had 3 shots on goal in the first 15 minutes. One called for a quality save by the keeper.
That said, while he is clever at ticking the ball away and is a gnat constantly pestering the opposing backline, he needs to get much stronger. Way too often he is shrugged off by opponents and is in the ground. But he also draws a lot of fouls some of which are simply retaliation for being a pain in the ass.
Thoughts and comments, immediately after the game…
1st half –
When in possession, the USMNT morphed between a 4-2-2-2 and a 4-4-2 formation. When we were defending, we dropped into a 4-4-2, with Musha and LDT in the middle, Aaronson and the left, and Reyna on the right.
The formation and play still did not provide enough width or dynamic play coming from out wide, evidenced by not enough service from out wide to Balogun or Pepi.
31st minute – Balogun can’t take someone on 1v1, he had the chance on a counter, and pulled it back.
40th minute – Dest, dumb yellow and red card, Reyna subbed out…why him and not Balogun or Pepi?…should’ve been Balogun…was Reyna going to be subbed off at half?
Reyna subbed off cost us ball possession.
After red card, we lost structure, rhythm, possession, flow, and cohesiveness. After red card, we got scored on, and then we almost gave up another two goals. The team needs to show more mental strength and fortitude.
Dest red card is just another example of Dest being self-serving and putting himself before the team, normally it manifests itself in stepovers and slick “street passes” instead of defending and defensive effort. To boot, he kept arguing with EVERY teammate, including Matt Turner as he walked around the field. Given the Gio situation at the WC, will Dest have to apologize to the team?
2nd half –
2nd T&T goal – Matt Turner should be back on ESPN NOT top 10, he should definitely make that save.
T&T’s #9 missed 3 quality chances, if he could finish, we could’ve been headed to the Copa America play-in games.
This game was another example of Berhalter;s inability to make in game tactical changes based on how the game is unfolding and his inability to make impactful subs.
For those that thought we should use B or C team players for this window / games, or for the ones that thought we should take bruising / thug players to T&T, are you still of that mindset?
Dest did apologize to the team, but that is not enough. What will he do to change?
TNT’s 2nd goal was not an easy save. it swerved right (which Turner had covered) and then knuckled left to go off the back of Turner’s hand and in. It was a great strike.
Disagree about Turner. All he had to do was knock it aside. A good keeper doesn’t give up a goal like that.I’ve been a Turner supporter for a couple of years, but while this was not a howler, it was pretty close to it. You get both hands on a shot, it shouldn’t be a goal.
GP: both goals were a little soft. the first one was high near post and he hadn’t gotten over fast enough. the second one was another far post alvin jones special like he did to howard, which i remember that time asking how does it get in. it’s a heck of a shot but it has to travel a long time in the air.
i always hear folks seeking revenge for the old games but IMO what fixes stuff is learning practical lessons. as in did we learn the keeper lesson about what cleats to wear in trinidad? details. one concern i have with some of this missionary-religion approach to system soccer is we don’t just oversell what our tactics offer, i expect better details work.
Dennis,
I respect your opinion about Turner and T&T’s second goal, but we will have to agree, to disagree. Alvin Jones struck the ball well, but candidly speaking, that is a save that MUST be made by the starting goalkeeper for the USMNT. Simple, as that.
“Dest did apologize to the team, but that is not enough. What will he do to change?”
What would be enough?
What do you propose?
Ban him from Copa America?
Dest blew a gasket. I’ve seen it happen but it’s not like he called his parents to dig up dirt on the referee.
Ban him from the Nations League final just to please the disciplinarians in the fan base, as if it really makes a difference. Gregg’s problem is he has to make sure the punishment works and hurts Dest more than it hurts the team.
If you have any ideas on how to do that I’d love to hear them.
Had this happened vs. Iran in Qatar there’s a good chance we lose and don’t advance. That’s a big deal.
But in this case, the reality is TNT needed to beat us 5-1. All the USMNT had to do was consolidate, keep calm and stop the mighty offensive juggernaut that is TNT from scoring 3 goals in about 30 minutes, something that should have been and was not beyond the capabilities of this particular USMNT.
I see the red card was a good thing because those guys need the practice of playing with ten men and “seeing out a game”. They need to be tested. It was a great way to remind those smarty pants who think the USMNT can just waltz past the TNT’s of the world with a pickup team.
This was more interesting to watch and more valuable than had they blown out TNT 6-0. Been there done that.
They did well on both counts.
“TNT’s 2nd goal was not an easy save. it swerved right (which Turner had covered) and then knuckled left to go off the back of Turner’s hand and in. It was a great strike.”
Matt might have had that shot had he not slipped on a piece of the turf that actually gave way under him as he set up for the save. Regardless, he did not have a great night, and could have done better on both goals.
He got beat near post on the first. I actually think he slipped right before the shot which is why he was so low. I agree, the first was tough from the knuckle.
Tele: when two different posters are saying turner seemed to slip on both goals do you see why i am saying maybe figure out the right cleats? we seem obsessed with stats analytics any stats 101 student could come up with or any soccer nerd could parrot. how about actual soccer knowledge? because my response to player footing problems is you wore the wrong boots. and with consistent road destinations we should have a database on how to prepare to play different places. like specific soccer earned knowledge as opposed to numerology.
to Vacqui
For his faults, GB handled some pretty public player problems with McKennie and Reyna. Both of those guys made some mea culpas and they changed their behavior. How? Why? We will likely never know until those involved write autobiographies.
Dest apologizing, like McKennie and Reyna did is a good first step. My wife was a marriage and family counsellor for decades and was quite good at it. She knows that therapy can change behavior in regard to how they act in stressful situations. Whether GB tells Dest to get into counselling, or he does it himself does not matter. GB, you may recall has some experience with that himself.
This is Dest’s 2nd red card for the USMNT. GB and Dest need a long conversation about that and what Dest will do to prevent that from ever happening again. Basically 3 strikes and you’re out. No matter how good a player is if he is a time bomb about to reduce the team to 10 men, he is fairly useless.
Tele and IV,
On the slip I was referring to it looked like a divot the size of your average large WELCOME mat came out. That’s probably an exaggeration but not that much. I’m not sure how much changing your cleats would have helped when basically the whole “floor” gives way.
“because my response to player footing problems is you wore the wrong boots. and with consistent road destinations we should have a database on how to prepare to play different places. like specific soccer earned knowledge as opposed to numerology.”
I’m not sure about the other incidents that IV refers to but slipping is one thing, while getting an injury because your cleats get caught in something is worse.
Regardless, the cowardly USSF should protest and refuse to play on such inherently unsafe fields. But what it will take is some star player get his cleats caught and rupturing something in his knee before action is taken.
Vac, if Dest also buys me a new amp, I will think that is enough. Right now I have a collection of broken amps. As such, I haven’t been playing which made it rain in trinidad and then Matt Turner wore the wrong cleats because he didn’t play at a top college where they taught people how to choose the right cleats and the US lost 2-1 because he slipped. Any future calamities can be avoided with a new amp, but it has to have tubes.
Tele57
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dCSDfjAyBhY
If you have never played through one of these high end tube amps it’s hard to know what you’re missing. But far be it from me to separate someone from their tubes but then there is the issue of expense and upkeep with tube amps.
Which is the trouble with a lot of CONCACAF fields. CONCACAF needs to figure out a way to help members with keeping their venues to a higher standard.
I’m talking about stuff that goes beyond just appropriate footwear.
One of these days Matt Turner is going to fall into a sink hole and thus be unable to stop a shot. I’ll bet you if it had been Argentina, Messi might have refused to play.
Papi, to me that is a pretty accurate summary although I think you missed the negative impact Aaronson had. Not to pick on the guy because I have nothing against him and I root for him, but he just isn’t very good right now and hasnt been for a long time. I think the worst coaching decision he made was starting him because the last year of data points says that was exactly what should have been expected and not getting him off the field in the first half was also a huge mistake. Pulling Reyna was to save a sub and get another defender on the field right away as Reyna was only going to play 45 minutes so I don’t think that was a bad move. I hoped for a Pepi and Balogon togethor but it wasn’t stellar. In fairneass to them, they weren’t the only players to have bad games. Tillman was probably the best player and had he come on for Aaronson early in first half, things may have been a little different. Tillman was bad in the first leg, but Aaronson was no better. Aaronson didn’t change that game, Pepi did (mostly by scoring a great goal but what better way to change a game).
Brendan has been crap since he went to Leeds, where Americans go to taint their careers..
The thing is it’s subtle crappiness. It’s as if he is just a few millimeters off from where he was when he was going good but those few millimeters are enough to screw him up ( I wanted to avoid saying it is a game of inches).
Will he ever get it back?
Maybe but the longer he goes the tougher it is.
He’s not confident.
But he can still run all day long and still pester people and there is a value to that against a team like TNT who are not capable of taking advantage of Brenden the way an EPL team could. Y’all say you’re so embarrassed by this game.
But I was acutely embarrassed FOR Brenden.
He doesn’t look like he belongs out there anymore.